Sansui Amps Owners & Discussion Thread

[MrMojo]

2 hours ago, Cafad said:

What are you using as a pre/source?  I know the 907 Ltd was giving me good bass with my YBA cd spinner as the source, via the non-direct inputs (ie using the 907 Ltd's built in pre) but when I brought out the 917 cd spinner and hooked it up to the direct inputs the quality of the bass jumped significantly (as did the quality of several other aspects of the music as well, but more on that later).   The B-2103 only has a 10KOhm input impedance so to get good bass out of it it will need a pre with a nice and low output impedance.

 

Yes, I hope to get to a detailed comparison between the 907 Ltd, MR and NRA, and everything else in fact.  It may take some time but I plan to get there eventually.

I have only received the amp few days ago, so at the moment, I am short of a pre that is a good match for B-2103 performance wise, so my source is directly connected to the amp via variable balanced input. I find it sounds pretty nice, clear and detailed but never harsh. Sounds much better than the cd direct input on my 607MR which sounds rather flat to my ears.The bass signature is in fact similar to 607MR (via non-direct inputs) so I suppose it could as well be my source or the room.

 

The search is still on for a nice transparent pre in the mean while. Those Sansui vintage preamps are getting rather expensive now a days.. 

 

 

[blakey72]

Damn you Jeff. I knew I shouldn't have looked at this thread when I have no money. I was trying to forget those high end models  

[Cafad]

On 3/12/2018 at 7:42 PM, MrMojo said:

The search is still on for a nice transparent pre in the mean while. Those Sansui vintage preamps are getting rather expensive now a days.. 

 

I bet they're worth it though. 

 

2 hours ago, blakey72 said:

Damn you Jeff. I knew I shouldn't have looked at this thread when I have no money. I was trying to forget those high end models  

Yeah, that is a problem, once heard Sansuis just can't be forgotten.  

Don't worry mate, I'll keep one for ya.

[blakey72]

Ahhhhh that's 'music to my ears' @Cafad. I'll just have to cherish my hotted up  4900. It's due tomorrow  I might put a thread up.

[Cafad]

10 minutes ago, blakey72 said:

Ahhhhh that's 'music to my ears' @Cafad. I'll just have to cherish my hotted up  4900. It's due tomorrow  I might put a thread up.

That sounds like a plan.  With pics of course.

[blakey72]

22 minutes ago, Cafad said:

That sounds like a plan.  With pics of course.

Oh yeah. Detailed pics

[scuzzii]

On ‎3‎/‎11‎/‎2018 at 10:09 AM, Cafad said:

Yes, gold star for you MrMojo, the mystery Sansui is indeed a 907 Limited.  And a very nice beast it is too, handsome and musical in equal parts.  It has passed through the hands of SNA'ers @scuzzii and @rantan and is currently safely ensconced in the audio fortress that is the house of Cafad.

 

Sound signature wise it is squarely in the middle between the XR and the NRA.  It has a slightly more earthy feel to it than the XR and a light level of warmth in the upper mids that seems to increase listen-ability and banish listening fatigue even further from the room than usual.  It also has some of that NRA magic in the vocals, not quite as polished as the NRA and with a little more air but certainly close enough for direct comparisons to be expected.

 

It also runs 7 or 8 degrees warmer than any of the other 907s.  

 

So far in this musical journey of mine I have heard several mosfet amps and my opinion of them so far has been mixed, some good, some average, and some very good in certain areas but lacking in others.  But this, this is a very nice mosfet design execution, excelling in most areas and lacking in none.  It does need a 20 minute warm up to sound its best but what the heck, it's 24 years old so what's a little warm up time between friends?

looking the business indeed Jeff.  Nice to see it in action and providing you lots of listening pleasure.

 

Enjoy mate, as I know you are from our discussions.  It is a truly fantastic Amp and a piece of HiFi history that can never be replicated.

[Cafad]

1 hour ago, scuzzii said:

looking the business indeed Jeff.  Nice to see it in action and providing you lots of listening pleasure.

 

Enjoy mate, as I know you are from our discussions.  It is a truly fantastic Amp and a piece of HiFi history that can never be replicated.

It certainly is John, a very impressive amp that looks as good as it sounds.

 

I think it might be time to get a bit more serious.  Time to bring in a Sansui source.

 

After all how can you directly compare a group of Sansuis if you aren't using a Sansui to feed them?

This is where we move away from my usual method of using the Sansuis as traditional integrated amps.  For the next however-long-it-takes I will be using the Sansui CD 917XR to feed a signal into the "CD Direct" inputs of each 907.  This means that each 907 is acting as a power amp with a passive volume control, which Sansui seem to believe is the way they should be listened to (as do many of their fans).

 

The Sansui CD 917XR is an excellent cd player, priced at 160,000 yen in 1993 (through a little google related calculating that translates to about $2133 aud  in 1993, which, allowing for inflation, translates to a new price of about $3613 aud in 2017) so it's a pretty serious player.

I don't have the original remote so I'm leaving it on maximum output and using the volume control on each amp to take care of listening levels.  Interconnects are Aurealis unbalanced, unchanged from my usual set up.

 

I think it deserves another pic...

 

There we go, now I just have to swap out the DR for the MR and it's straight into the listening.

Edited March 17, 2018 by Cafad

[blakey72]

I love that cd player. Sounds awesome 

[scuzzii]

I love that cd player. Sounds awesome 

Love how the side panels much. Jeff has done very well procuring that

[huxmut]

All very nice bits of gear for sure.

I wonder how long the line for these once you've had your way with them ?

[Cafad]

Not very long just yet, only two have called dibs so far, but I'm sure the line will lengthen with time.

[Cafad]

OK, this is obviously the way Sansui intended for their amps to be used because they all sound so damn good.  

The behaviour I noted above is still prevalent but the overall listen-ability level is much higher when using the "direct" inputs.

The NRA pushes its sound stage out to the sides and back further and gives much of the mids, lightly played strings especially, room to breath in a large-but-relaxed manner.  Vocals are the main focus but this is only really blatantly obvious when the vocalist is actually earning their money (ie really working those vocal cords).  Amy Lee, Montaigne, Enya, are really special when heard on the NRA.

 

The MR shows much more gain than the NRA, the volume control had to be set at least one o'clock lower at all times, it once again comes across as a bigger sounding amp and it applies that spotlight effect on the entire mid range.  Instrumentals come across more forcefully than they do on the NRA and you would think that with my oft-mentioned love of rock-to-hard-rock music the result of this comparison would be a no-brainer.  But it isn't that simple.  I  do love the MR much more now that I'm using the 917 and the cd direct input to listen through and it is not an amp you can ignore easily, even when you are trying to use it for just a bit of background music but I'm not sure I would like that added spotlight effect (I think I will have to call it brightness eventually, but it is brightness of the good kind without any brittle, hard or jagged tinges to it) all the time.  I may have to use it continually for a week or so and see how I feel about it afterwards.  It comes across as more energetic, more flamboyant and more pumped up with harder rock than the NRA does, and it definitely has more energy in the drums, and the bass region in general, than the NRA.  However, it falls behind a little if you up the ante to a truly world class vocalist.

 

The 907 Limited is up later today, until then here's another picture.

Almost forgot about my Sansui sign.  That's the one that I hung in my window so that Blake could find my place when he dropped in a while back.  It didn't work, but the thought was there.

 

Edit:  After some listening I have come to the conclusion that my prior post regarding the sound signature of the 907 Ltd is still relevant.   I said;

Sound signature wise it is squarely in the middle between the XR and the NRA.  It has a slightly more earthy feel to it than the XR and a light level of warmth in the upper mids that seems to increase listen-ability and banish listening fatigue even further from the room than usual.  It also has some of that NRA magic in the vocals, not quite as polished as the NRA and with a little more air but certainly close enough for direct comparisons to be expected.

I'll expand on this a little to add that the 907 Ltd has more of an earthy feel to it with more texture to the music.  This particular texture is sort of, kind of but not really related to grain but not in a way that sounds negative, more in a way that sounds interesting and slightly different.  I've been trying to find a way to describe it more accurately for almost a week now and not doing very well at it.  That warmth I mention is not a light and fuzzy warmth either, not like a Luxman, it is a more broad, slightly harder warmth.  Warm, but not smooth, and gravelly in a similar way to Mark Knopfler's voice.

It feels a little more tactile than most music, if you can imagine listening to a song while following the music and lyrics in braille (with your fingers, obviously).  That's pretty close to the way it makes me feel. 

So, yes, textured, gravelly and tactile are the best I can do so far.  But I'll keep trying.

Edited March 22, 2018 by Cafad

[Cafad]

It has been interesting listening to the XR after its younger siblings.  It doesn't have the floodlight that the MR uses to emphasize the mid range so it feels more evenly weighted than the MR.  Drums feel a little more prevalent but it may just be that they aren't being placed outside that MR light and so are more easily noticed.  Vocals are still excellent, not quite as delicate or with as much sense of poise as the later models but still damn fine to listen to.  Very similar to the MR (as I believe has been mentioned a few times in other forums) but a little less forward and a little less bright.  Or you could call the MR a more centrally focused version of the XR, that would work too.

 

And another picture, because less is certainly not more when it comes to pictures.

[Cafad]

The KX has a slightly lighter tone than the XR.  It also has a little more crispness noticeable on lighter percussion but those two small differences are the only ones I can detect.  There may be a little more air to the upper mids but I wouldn't bet on it.  

Interestingly that small crispness means that I prefer the KX to the XR on any track that lets the drummer really go to town.  Sometimes small differences are all you need.

Vocals, while still excellent, are pretty much the same as the XR.

 

[Cafad]

The DR seems to have been Sansuis effort to embrace the digital sound.  It has a little more of that "hard air" that is often associated with earlier digital recordings and replaying efforts.  This works really well with my cds that were recorded in the 80s (prior to any remastering efforts) because that's the way I remember them sounding so that, to me, is the way they should sound.  Major points for nostalgia effects there.

Bass is a little bigger and "more sudden", it feels slightly faster than it did on the KX but not deeper.  

Again the differences are not particularly big, but they are there.

[Cafad]

OK, I've found a big difference in "Sansui-ness".  Changing from the DR to the L Extra was quite a shock.  Lower resolution and detail for sure, but... that also means a complete lack of all those digital nasties (no brittle highs, no hard edges to percussion or strongly played piano and no overly crisp feel to the whole song that makes you feel like you are listening while eating a salad).  I have this feeling that I have really stepped back in time here, and yet the overall effect of this lower resolution/detail is not an unpleasant one.  Not at all.  

So extra resolution and detail start with the DR folks.  Could be a good or a bad thing depending on your personal stance on sources.  

This lower res effect certainly doesn't detract from the enjoyment level, it doesn't take the form of a more warm presentation as the earlier Sansui models did, more a feel of a bit of wooly-ness behind the sound stage.  This means that the L Extra doesn't feel quite as musical as the later models.  Also, while the softer vocals are pretty much indistinguishable from the DR through XR harder sung vocals are not as satisfying.  They feel as if they lack nuance.

Still a good amp, but not quite as likable as the later models IMO.

 

Edited May 30, 2018 by Cafad
typo

[Wazza007]

Wow what a great read I have sought after Sansui comparisons like this for a long time, this is the best line -up and review I've seen. 

I own a Sansui Au 907 L Extra and I've had the pleasure of hearing the 907 Limited when in the hands of Scuzzi on many occasions.

You have put into words my feeling about the extra I could never articulate and the biggest surprise for me is the sound of digital music particularly playing mp3 (eek will the music gods strike me down) etc via CD player what a difference! you almost get a vinyl sound. Thanks again great line up and very well reviewed.

 

Cheers

[Cafad]

Hi Wazza, good to hear that I've managed to assist a fellow SNA'er in something, even if only in describing a listening experience.

And I wouldn't worry about the mp3 thing, I'm just as likely to be sought out and sanctioned by the Sansui Society for using words like "low resolution" in a description of a 907.

 

Does my description of the sound of the 907 Limited gel with your experiences with it back when John had it?  He seems happy with my description (and we agree on a comparison or two with other integrated amps that we have both heard) but it's always good to get a second opinion.

[Powerglide]

Off to see the Grand Poobah today and see why I'm stuck in protection mode 

[mpearce38]

On 03/08/2017 at 4:42 AM, Snapper() said:

Yes using him currently to troubleshoot a weird grounding issue on my au-6600. He is thorough but has been out of the game for a while.
I dont think he can take on a huge amount of work though and mine is the first sansui he has worked on.
Nice guy. He was also fixing some turntables. For vintage stuff would be fine but havent got my item back yet.

I have used truscotts electronic world in bayswater before.

Troubleshoot a NAD 356bee dry joint issue $100.
Repair sansui au 101 or 505 failed transistor and couple of caps $100

Sent from my SM-G935F using Tapatalk
 

Hi Snapper

 

How did you go with this guy. Just picked up an AU7900 and want to get it recapped and serviced doesn't seem to be too many good techs Melbourne way

[gator2310]

Depending on the complexity of the job - I have heard that the guy at Round Again in Coburg is quite reliable. He outsources the work but a friend of mine had his AU555 fixed after serial issues with it.  I bought my 217 mkii there - it had been repaired and runs like a swiss watch. Nice guy too.

But yes - I'm not looking forward to my suis needing any serious work as the choices in Melbourne are very limited for a town this size. So far so good.

Edited April 10, 2018 by gator2310

[PKay]

Given the lack of Sansui locals in Melbourne it may be worth paying for shipping up to Sydney, especially if the plan is to keep the amp for a longer time. 

[MrMojo]

4 hours ago, gator2310 said:

Depending on the complexity of the job - I have heard that the guy at Round Again in Coburg is quite reliable. He outsources the work but a friend of mine had his AU555 fixed after serial issues with it.  I bought my 217 mkii there - it had been repaired and runs like a swiss watch. Nice guy too.

But yes - I'm not looking forward to my suis needing any serious work as the choices in Melbourne are very limited for a town this size. So far so good.

Been there done that. If you love your Sansui, or any other vintage equipment for that matter, and want the job done properly, then I would strongly advise against going to Round Again. The 'tech' there is not skilled enough to fix anything more than a table radio. On top of that, the lack of professional ethics and courtesy is appalling. I can give anyone the details of my experience, but that is pretty much the lesson and gist of it.

 

Edited April 11, 2018 by MrMojo

[gator2310]

25 minutes ago, MrMojo said:

Been there done that. If you love your Sansui, or any other vintage equipment for that matter, and want the job done properly, then I would strongly advise against going to Round Again. The 'tech' there is not skilled enough to fix anything more than a table radio. On top of that, the lack of professional ethics and courtesy is appalling. I can give anyone the details of my experience, but that is pretty much the lesson and gist of it.

 

Well not my experience but nothing would surprise me - there you go - another one bites the dust!