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Hi,

 

I'm considering installation of some form of surge protection as well as power filtering at the fuse box within my home.  I've had a couple of A/V units pack up recently (projector, AVR, 2x TV's), and the first thing the retailers or servicing people mention is power surges.  (For information, a couple of units had excessive dust in them, and this issue has been addressed via a filter on the air return duct within the house).

 

To be honest, I'm skeptical - I know power surges can occur, but I feel it's very convenient for a sales rep to mention it because it can void a warranty claim.  I'm not very savvy with the products on the market, nor what results I could expect.  I'm looking at something like the Thor DRM95-20A -

 

https://www.thortechnologies.com.au/product/drm95-20a/

 

I am hoping to gain the following benefits -

 

  1. Protection from power surges (even if it assists any warranty claims in the future);
  2. Consistent power supply to my A/V gear;
  3. Better performance from my A/V gear;
  4. Filtering of noise in the power supply to the house.

 

Is it realistic to expect gains in these areas with a unit situated at the power board?

Are there any other products worth looking at?  (TBO, the Thor at $400 + installation is, what I consider to be, a cheap solution).

Does anyone have any personal experience with these types of products?

 

 

 

There are two rooms that have A/V set-ups, and neither is on their own separate power circuit.  I'd prefer to explore this option before looking at power conditioners in each room.

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The DRM-95 will help with #1 - power surges but won't stop a nearby or direct lightning strike - nothing short of unplugging your equipment from the wall sockets will. 

#2 - if you mean a provide a constant voltage - no it doesn't. You need a transformer or power re-gen for that. 

#3 - maybe/probably. 

#4 - yes.  

You would get maximum benefit from a dedicated circuit for one or both A/V systems plus the DRM. Some ppl say that filtering might rob a system of dynamics but with the DRM it was never my experience. 

 

 

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1 minute ago, frankn said:

The DRM-95 will help with #1 - power surges but won't stop a nearby or direct lightning strike - nothing short of unplugging your equipment from the wall sockets will. 

#2 - if you mean a provide a constant voltage - no it doesn't. You need a transformer or power re-gen for that. 

#3 - maybe/probably. 

#4 - yes.  

You would get maximum benefit from a dedicated circuit for one or both A/V systems plus the DRM. Some ppl say that filtering might rob a system of dynamics but with the DRM it was never my experience. 

 

 

 

 

Thanks @frankn .  Okay so the limitations for power surges would be lightening strikes, good to know.

Yeah I mean constant regular supply at 240 volts, instead of the fluctuations that seem to be experienced when people measure their power supply.

So it seems the unit can/should provide benefits to most of what I'm considering.

 

 

A dedicated circuit for both systems is not out of the question, but then consideration of using a power conditioning unit is each set-up comes in to play, something like the Thor PS10 - especially with the installing of a DRM for both circuits.

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In order of installing I'd recommend the dedicated circuits 1st,  then a single DRM  to see how much improvement you experience (everyone's result will be different). If you have 2 circuits one with DRM and one without you could compare (use a long, heavy duty extension cord). 

I think you can purchase a cheap voltage measuring device to check how much your voltage varies - PS10 may not be worth it. 

 

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20 minutes ago, frankn said:

In order of installing I'd recommend the dedicated circuits 1st,  then a single DRM  to see how much improvement you experience (everyone's result will be different). If you have 2 circuits one with DRM and one without you could compare (use a long, heavy duty extension cord). 

I think you can purchase a cheap voltage measuring device to check how much your voltage varies - PS10 may not be worth it. 

 

 

 

Good advice @frankn , thanks.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 5/28/2017 at 0:27 PM, Kaynin said:

Hi,

 

I'm considering installation of some form of surge protection as well as power filtering at the fuse box within my home.  I've had a couple of A/V units pack up recently (projector, AVR, 2x TV's), and the first thing the retailers or servicing people mention is power surges.  (For information, a couple of units had excessive dust in them, and this issue has been addressed via a filter on the air return duct within the house).

 

Retailers suggest such things, because:

 

1) They make money on 'surge limiters'.

2) They sell rubbish equipment and try to deflect the problem away from reality.

 

Quality equipment doesn't need surge limit protection. The only exception being nearby lightning strikes. The solution is to ensure the TV antenna is disconnected. Problem solved. If you REALLY want surge protection, then have one fitted by a qualified electrician, at your fuse box. It's the only solution that will do something (though I remain unconvinced of it's usefulness anyway). 

 

Your equipment failed, but it was not due to 'surges'. 

 

On 5/28/2017 at 0:27 PM, Kaynin said:

 

To be honest, I'm skeptical - I know power surges can occur, but I feel it's very convenient for a sales rep to mention it because it can void a warranty claim. 

 

Take it to the ACCC. Those companies cannot hide behind the mandatory use of surge limiters in their waranty statement. Again, ANY salesdroid who claims otherwise should be taken to task and reported to the ACCC. Immediately. And yes, that sort of nonsense makes me very angry indeed. 

 

On 5/28/2017 at 0:27 PM, Kaynin said:

I'm not very savvy with the products on the market, nor what results I could expect.  I'm looking at something like the Thor DRM95-20A -

 

https://www.thortechnologies.com.au/product/drm95-20a/

 

I am hoping to gain the following benefits -

 

  1. Protection from power surges (even if it assists any warranty claims in the future);
  2. Consistent power supply to my A/V gear;
  3. Better performance from my A/V gear;
  4. Filtering of noise in the power supply to the house.

 

None of which should be necessary when using quality equipment. 

 

On 5/28/2017 at 0:27 PM, Kaynin said:

 

Is it realistic to expect gains in these areas with a unit situated at the power board?

 

No.

 

On 5/28/2017 at 0:27 PM, Kaynin said:

Are there any other products worth looking at?  (TBO, the Thor at $400 + installation is, what I consider to be, a cheap solution).

Does anyone have any personal experience with these types of products?

 

Have a surge limiter fitted at your fuse box, if you really want to spend money on something that MIGHT be helpful. 

 

On 5/28/2017 at 0:27 PM, Kaynin said:

 

 

 

There are two rooms that have A/V set-ups, and neither is on their own separate power circuit.  I'd prefer to explore this option before looking at power conditioners in each room.

 

A good idea. Separate power circuits are a good idea. That said, the one thing I will say about one of the Thor units, is that it uses filtering on each socket, which means any interference from an item of audio equipment that uses a SMPS will be effectively filtered. 

 

But really, it is all so unnecessary. 

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39 minutes ago, Zaphod Beeblebrox said:

 

Retailers suggest such things, because:

 

1) They make money on 'surge limiters'.

2) They sell rubbish equipment and try to deflect the problem away from reality.

 

Quality equipment doesn't need surge limit protection. The only exception being nearby lightning strikes. The solution is to ensure the TV antenna is disconnected. Problem solved. If you REALLY want surge protection, then have one fitted by a qualified electrician, at your fuse box. It's the only solution that will do something (though I remain unconvinced of it's usefulness anyway). 

 

Your equipment failed, but it was not due to 'surges'. 

 

 

Take it to the ACCC. Those companies cannot hide behind the mandatory use of surge limiters in their waranty statement. Again, ANY salesdroid who claims otherwise should be taken to task and reported to the ACCC. Immediately. And yes, that sort of nonsense makes me very angry indeed. 

 

 

None of which should be necessary when using quality equipment. 

 

 

No.

 

 

Have a surge limiter fitted at your fuse box, if you really want to spend money on something that MIGHT be helpful. 

 

 

A good idea. Separate power circuits are a good idea. That said, the one thing I will say about one of the Thor units, is that it uses filtering on each socket, which means any interference from an item of audio equipment that uses a SMPS will be effectively filtered. 

 

But really, it is all so unnecessary. 

 

 

Thanks for the input Zaph, very much appreciated and good information.  I might just hold on to my $$$ and invest in better gear!

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1 minute ago, Kaynin said:

 

 

Thanks for the input Zaph, very much appreciated and good information.  I might just hold on to my $$$ and invest in better gear!

 

Great idea. I should say that I am in the service biz. In my 40+ years of doing this stuff, there has not a single instance where I could honestly state that a surge protector would have prevented an item from being damaged. I have, however, seen many products that would have been saved, if the TV antenna had been unplugged. Lighting can be a problem, not mains bourne 'surges'. 

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4 minutes ago, Zaphod Beeblebrox said:

 

Great idea. I should say that I am in the service biz. In my 40+ years of doing this stuff, there has not a single instance where I could honestly state that a surge protector would have prevented an item from being damaged. I have, however, seen many products that would have been saved, if the TV antenna had been unplugged. Lighting can be a problem, not mains bourne 'surges'. 

 

 

I was never aware of this, great to know. 

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Or the phone line was disconnected, or the lightning didn't travel along the earth wire, or through the power grid, or maybe a direct strike like I had in February. In todays times & with the price of things as they have become, with the advent of technology, there are many and a few of which are good. Are you intending on staying in that house for 20+ years or would it be common sense to try a proven product that you can take with you?

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2 minutes ago, bzr said:

Or the phone line was disconnected, or the lightning didn't travel along the earth wire, or through the power grid, or maybe a direct strike like I had in February. In todays times & with the price of things as they have become, with the advent of technology, there are many and a few of which are good. Are you intending on staying in that house for 20+ years or would it be common sense to try a proven product that you can take with you?

 

Like unplugging the TV antenna during a lightning storm. There is no commercial (or military) product that can effectively deal with a direct lightning strike. Unplugging the antenna is cheap, portable and highly effective. 

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10 minutes ago, bzr said:

Or the phone line was disconnected, or the lightning didn't travel along the earth wire, or through the power grid, or maybe a direct strike like I had in February. In todays times & with the price of things as they have become, with the advent of technology, there are many and a few of which are good. Are you intending on staying in that house for 20+ years or would it be common sense to try a proven product that you can take with you?

 

 

I can happily say that I'll be carried out of this house in a pine box...  :unsure:

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  • 9 months later...

So any further opinions specifically on the Thor DRM95?

 

So it won’t protect from lightning strikes, but is it good for filtering low level noise?

Ive noticed that my system sounds worse from 5 to 9PM. I live close to many shops. I’m on a main road so the ambient noise doesn’t change, so could the change in sound be electrically related?

Could the Thor help?

Could the Thor be detrimental in anyway, if the entire audio circuit is on that one line?

 

Ive tried filtered power boards in the past and they made amp sound worse. Same with this Thor 95?

Edited by HumanMedia
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Not quite on point to your question, but I did have one of the Smart Boards (I think the $250 one) and it throttled the music.  Music sounded much better without the board in the system, so I sold it.  I have kept the Thor PS 10 for surge protection purposes and am a champion for those.

 

You may want to contact andyr about his DC blocker.  What little I know of electronics tells me that such devices do not work.  Unfortunately, my ears tell me otherwise. For the sake of preventing lengthy discussion about double blind tests and so on and so forth, for we all have had deja vu and ad nauseum on that one, let me file this under 'placebo effect' and note that I am prepared to pay $ to have this placebo effect in my system, as I mystically heard a cleaner, less noisy sound.

 

 

 

 

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On 5/28/2017 at 12:27 PM, Kaynin said:

Hi,

 

I'm considering installation of some form of surge protection as well as power filtering at the fuse box within my home.  I've had a couple of A/V units pack up recently (projector, AVR, 2x TV's), and the first thing the retailers or servicing people mention is power surges.  (For information, a couple of units had excessive dust in them, and this issue has been addressed via a filter on the air return duct within the house).

 

To be honest, I'm skeptical - I know power surges can occur, but I feel it's very convenient for a sales rep to mention it because it can void a warranty claim.  I'm not very savvy with the products on the market, nor what results I could expect.  I'm looking at something like the Thor DRM95-20A -

 

https://www.thortechnologies.com.au/product/drm95-20a/

 

I am hoping to gain the following benefits -

 

  1. Protection from power surges (even if it assists any warranty claims in the future);
  2. Consistent power supply to my A/V gear;
  3. Better performance from my A/V gear;
  4. Filtering of noise in the power supply to the house.

 

Is it realistic to expect gains in these areas with a unit situated at the power board?

Are there any other products worth looking at?  (TBO, the Thor at $400 + installation is, what I consider to be, a cheap solution).

Does anyone have any personal experience with these types of products?

 

There are two rooms that have A/V set-ups, and neither is on their own separate power circuit.  I'd prefer to explore this option before looking at power conditioners in each room.

 

On 5/28/2017 at 12:51 PM, frankn said:

The DRM-95 will help with #1 - power surges but won't stop a nearby or direct lightning strike - nothing short of unplugging your equipment from the wall sockets will. 

#2 - if you mean a provide a constant voltage - no it doesn't. You need a transformer or power re-gen for that. 

#3 - maybe/probably. 

#4 - yes.  

You would get maximum benefit from a dedicated circuit for one or both A/V systems plus the DRM. Some ppl say that filtering might rob a system of dynamics but with the DRM it was never my experience. 

 

 

 

As Frank said, the DRM-95 - installed at your switchboard - will help with power surges.  And if your 2 rooms are both on the same electrical circuit ... it will be able to help with surges to both systems.

 

But to enable you to get a consistent 240v - or 230v ... you need what TDD has - a Thor PS10.  And if your 2x AV systems are on separate circuits (even though neither of them has a dedicated circuit) - then you'll need 2x Thor PS10s!  (Expensive!  :( )

 

The DC blocker that TDD mentioned is for a different problem.  You mentioned #4 - (hash) filtering;  this is yet another device - and you may find that such a device helps your AV system.  I have a 4-way hash filter controlling power to my:

  • TV
  • Foxtel box
  • DVD player, and
  • VHS player.

Given you're in Vic (Melbourne!), you can borrow these devices if you want to see whether they do anything good for you.  PM me if you're interested.  (But you need a Thor PS10 or similar, to control the voltage you're getting.)

 

Andy

 

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I'm also interested in surge protection. I'm down in a saddle so unlikely to get a lightning hit on my terrestrial antenna (lots of other higher houses and trees) but I am worried about a hit to a pole carrying NBN HFC. It could travel through the HFC, through my modem/router and wired ethernet and then hit connected streamer etc etc. to basically everything. And I suppose it wouldn't need to be a near hit either.

 

Can anyone recommend any wired ethernet solution to stop power spikes?

 

I googled this but know very little about it. http://www.rojone.com.au/category/h-components-passive/lightning-protection/

 

John

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On 28/05/2017 at 12:27 PM, Kaynin said:

it can void a warranty claim.

Not unless they can prove the damage was from a surge, which is very hard to do... say ya fridge packed it in, it would be replaced/repaired generally speaking.

 

JSmith :ninja:

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1 hour ago, JSmith said:

Not unless they can prove the damage was from a surge

 

 

Who has to prove it? 

Do you have to prove it wasn't a surge, or do they have to prove that it was?

Do they only have to say it's "likely" a power surge and that's enough to void a warranty?

 

 

 

The other thing is that some retailers have their own in-house "technicians".  Obviously they aren't impartial, so where do you stand if they say it's likely a power surge...

 

 

 

I find that sales reps are very quick to "suggest" it was a power surge, for obvious reasons of palming responsibility off...

 

 

Edited by Kaynin
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1 hour ago, Kaynin said:

they have to prove that it was?

I'd say so... when a products power supply fails, general retailers have never mentioned surges to me and have always accepted the product back as simply faulty.

 

Further, if you are able to prove damage was caused by the power supplier, you can attempt to claim compensation from the Energy company;

 

https://www.accc.gov.au/media-release/accc-gets-compensation-and-warns-on-consumers-rights

 

JSmith :ninja:

Edited by JSmith
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