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Has anyone done the upgrade to their MA1? It would be interesting to get actual user thoughts especially regarding cost vs SQ improvement. I have copied the blurb from the Puremusic Group website.

 

http://puremusicgroup.com/cart/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=665

 

Meitner MA-1 V2 and EMM Labs DAC2X V2

Using technology developed in their flagship DA2, EMM Labs and Meitner Audio has updated both multi-award winning DACs the Meitner Audio MA-1 DAC and EMM Labs DAC2X. The updates provide a huge improvement in transparency, accuracy and overall sound quality.  The new V2 unit updates consist of:

 

•         MDAC™ in both platforms are now fully discrete DSD512/8xDSD D/A converters completely built in-house at the manufacturing facility in Canada

•         The multi-award winning MDAT2™ DSP has also been refined and updated to synergistically work with the new 8xDSD MDAC™. The new MDAT2™ DSP does real-time transient detection, processing

           and up-conversion of all incoming audio, PCM and DSD, before sending it to the new MDAC™

•         The DSD audio signal path has been re-designed allowing for further enhancements in transparency during the DSD to Analog conversion process

•         Proprietary hardware galvanic isolation for the USB Audio interface

•         Support for DSD128/2xDSD and DXD streaming via USB Audio

•         Support for DSD (DoP) streaming via TOSLINK, SPDIF and AES

 

Every other digital system from its proprietary jitter removal MFAST™ to its super accurate clock, MCLK™ has also been carefully revised as well for better sound.

 

EMM Labs and Meitner Audio is providing these significant V2 hardware and software upgrades to all customers who have purchased MA-1s and DAC2Xs.

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I upgraded my MA-1 to V2 on Monday.   Highly recommend the upgrade.   Summary of observations so far:   Clearer more open top end. Voice in particular is extremely b

Hi Aris,   Great feedback.  I thought I should also join the conversation for those who maybe considering this upgrade path.   I had my DAC2X upgraded by Warwick back in April so t

I don't use youtube to play my music. I have found Roon to be an excellent program linking my two remote drives over cat6 cables. You can get it for free on a two week trial (at least that was availab

Hmmmm.... Had been thinking of letting go the Emmy.

Maybe I should send them in for upgrade first.

 

I tore down the system way back in November, using the cables for the ns-5000 demo in a hifi show. Even after all the cables had been returned, I had been lazy to put everything back they were before.

 

Still am lazy....

 

 

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On 3/23/2017 at 11:31 PM, Sir Sanders Zingmore said:

Maybe ask Warwick ?

That would work for the Melbourne people.

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  • 1 month later...

@rwangnzI have noticed you are selling your upgraded version. Are you able to provide any information on the changes in terms of SQ?

Edited by Nap250
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On 16/05/2017 at 6:04 PM, rwangnz said:

@Nap250 I have been breaking it in lately. Will be doing a AB with the v1 within the next month or so at a friends house. 

Hopefully you would have sold them before that. Someone could buy mine and yours to compare. 

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  • 1 month later...
On 5/16/2017 at 6:04 PM, rwangnz said:

@Nap250 I have been breaking it in lately. Will be doing a AB with the v1 within the next month or so at a friends house. 

Any update? I have decided to keep mine albeit without upgrading. Matched up with my recent Silverline SR15s and Naim Nac 72/ Nap 140 and hicap DR the combo is sounding sublime (IMO).

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  • 2 weeks later...


  • 5 months later...

I upgraded my MA-1 to V2 on Monday.

 

Highly recommend the upgrade.

 

Summary of observations so far:

 

Clearer more open top end.

Voice in particular is extremely balanced.

Bass is tighter and seemingly deeper as a result.

There’s much more detail overall but still very fluid musicality.

I also think (or perceive) that it’s more dynamic - I hear more of the range in any case. 

 

Advice to anyone thinking of selling their MA-1 - get this upgrade instead.  

 

— Aris

 

Edited by aris
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Hi Aris,

 

Great feedback.  I thought I should also join the conversation for those who maybe considering this upgrade path.

 

I had my DAC2X upgraded by Warwick back in April so the upgraded unit has been running constantly in my system now for several months. For some history, I started with the MA-1 which I had for 10 months before trading for the DAC2X.  I have had the DAC2X now for around 3 years and have had no interest in moving to another manufacturer.  While the sound was the main reason for selecting EMM Labs DACs, the fact that they develop their own technology and therefore are able to provide software and sometimes hardware upgrade paths was also attractive.

 

What I experienced between version 1 to now version 2 is similar to yours and has been well worth the upgrade.  Before I discuss some of the aspects, I will make the usual statement that differences heard with any system change is alway very depended on the whole system and the room acoustics.  So others may experience similar or very different changes or no change.

 

The improvements I found are:

  • more air around instruments and vocals giving the already natural tone even more weight
  • improved textural content.  i.e. plucked strings, cymbals, etc just sound even more realistic with better timbre qualities.  
  • soundstage has also improved having a bit more depth and spacial content.  Better delimitation between instruments, vocals and their position in space.
  • the noise floor appears lower as tape hiss between tracks is more noticeable.  Not an issue, just an observation.
  • initial attack on notes is better adding to the improved dynamics.
  • overall words such as natural, liquid, smoothness, dynamic, crispness, coherent, spatial, depth all come to mind as improving.

 

All in all, I have found the improvements easily detectable and feel my system has step up in the natural tapestry of music.

 

Is the upgrade worth it?  Definitely.  Especially if your consider the upgrade cost to RRP of the DAC2X.  The upgrade costs around 15% of RRP with improvements that are easily distinguishable.  For MA-1 owners like yourself, the equation is a little harder as it represents more like 30% of RRP.  However, as you have concluded, I also believe the upgrade is well worth for any EMM Labs owner considering the investment.   An owner could potential loose a lot more just trading to another DAC.

 

Gavin

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11 hours ago, aris said:

I upgraded my MA-1 to V2 on Monday.

 

Highly recommend the upgrade.

 

Summary of observations so far:

 

Clearer more open top end.

Voice in particular is extremely balanced.

Bass is tighter and seemingly deeper as a result.

There’s much more detail overall but still very fluid musicality.

I also think (or perceive) that it’s more dynamic - I hear more of the range in any case. 

 

Advice to anyone thinking of selling their MA-1 - get this upgrade instead.  

 

— Aris

 

Alternatively buy a second hand unit and do the update through Warwick. The MA1 is one of my favourite DACs. 

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  • 2 months later...

I traded in my v1 unit of dac2x for a brand new v2 unit way back in June last year.

 

The brand new v2 unit sounded like ****. Really shitty.

 

Early December I checked with the dealer about getting my old dac back. He said all traded-in units are no longer available. I asked if i can downgrade to the single box xds1v2. He said there were no more stocks either. And then he stopped contacting me...

 

In Jan, over a 2-day period i noticed very audible sonic changes...

 

WTF! 6 months to run in the bloody thing!#@??! And then for the major changes to take place over a mere 48hrs period...!??!??

 

I'm glad the dealer never called me back.... haha!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by jeromelang
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5 hours ago, jeromelang said:

I traded in my v1 unit of dac2x for a brand new v2 unit way back in June last year.

 

The brand new v2 unit sounded like ****. Really shitty.

 

Early December I checked with the dealer about getting my old dac back. He said all traded-in units are no longer available. I asked if i can downgrade to the single box xds1v2. He said there were no more stocks either. And then he stopped contacting me...

 

In Jan, over a 2-day period i noticed very audible sonic changes...

 

WTF! 6 months to run in the bloody thing!#@??! And then for the major changes to take place over a mere 48hrs period...!??!??

 

I'm glad the dealer never called me back.... haha!

 

 

 

 

 

It’s great that the unit is sounding better but the run in period doesn’t make sense. Did you move any components or cables? 

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It puzzled me too. I've had xds1v1 and dac2xv1 in my system. They both sounded quite good straight out from the box, although they both took for months to smoothen out that slightly spiky top end, but they didn't sound like what the dac2xv2 did - closed-in, lacking top end extension, and jitter-type prickle in the ears. 

Edited by jeromelang
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without any system changes whatsoever the v2 unit's sound changed dramatically in a period of 2 days.

 

perhaps the longer than usual run-in time could be due to the fact that the v2 was unlistenable. i couldn't bear to listen to it even for half an hour at a time.

Edited by jeromelang
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On 06/12/2017 at 8:26 PM, aris said:

I upgraded my MA-1 to V2 on Monday.

 

Highly recommend the upgrade.

 

Summary of observations so far:

 

Clearer more open top end.

Voice in particular is extremely balanced.

Bass is tighter and seemingly deeper as a result.

There’s much more detail overall but still very fluid musicality.

I also think (or perceive) that it’s more dynamic - I hear more of the range in any case. 

 

Advice to anyone thinking of selling their MA-1 - get this upgrade instead.  

 

— Aris

 

what is next for you?

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I’m putting more emphasis on getting a power amp and pre/DAC. Wait and see how the Karan and Meitner sell and then see. I’m not necessarily expecting to get a “better” DAC than the Meitner - there are few at that level of performance or above.

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get a optical disc transport or get a streamer - instead of playing music files from a pc.

 

computers/pcs have memory retention problem - which affect sound quality.

 

some streamers clear-out previous track's memory before commencing to play subsequent tracks. this leads to more opened soundstaging, better dynamics and more engaging musical flow.

 

and instead of running the streamer in wireless mode, connect to the router with a high quality lan cable. 

 

optical disc transport is the tricky one....

 

 

Edited by jeromelang
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8 minutes ago, jeromelang said:

get a optical disc transport or get a streamer - instead of playing music files from a pc.

 

computers/pcs have memory retention problem - which affect sound quality.

 

some streamers clear-out previous track's memory before commencing to play subsequent tracks. this leads to more opened soundstaging, better dynamics and more engaging musical flow.

 

and instead of running the streamer in wireless mode, connect to the router with a high quality lan cable. 

 

optical disc transport is the tricky one....

 

 

I think if you use Roon with Lan you will be surprised at the results. I am using a gaming speccd computer to run roon. My Antipodes DS Reference is sitting unused expect as a second NAS device. A bit off topic but....just my two bobs worth.

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to help understand what is this memory retention problem:

 

play youtube music video through your audio system.

preferrably choose songs with abundance of ambience (natural or dsp'd)

 

play the desired track.

take note the soundstaging size, width, and especially height.

observe if the sound image is in front or behind speakers' baffles.

after 1 min, repeat that track from the beginning.

listen and observe if there are any changes to soundstage and imaging when you repeat the same track.

 

next play another track.

after 30 secs, go back and select the 1st track you played before to play it.

now observe if there are changes to the soundstage and imaging.

 

does it now sound like when you first selected it to play the first time?

or does it sound like what happens when you repeated it?

Edited by jeromelang
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10 minutes ago, jeromelang said:

to help understand what is this memory retention problem:

 

play youtube music video through your audio system.

preferrably choose songs with abundance of ambience (natural or dsp'd)

 

play the desired track.

take note the soundstaging size, width, and especially height.

observe if the sound image is in front or behind speakers' baffles.

after 1 min, repeat that track from the beginning.

listen and observe if there are any changes to soundstage and imaging when you repeat the same track.

 

next play another track.

after 30 secs, go back and select the 1st track you played before to play it.

now observe if there are changes to the soundstage and imaging.

 

does it now sound like when you first selected it to play the first time?

or does it sound like what happens when you repeated it?

I don't use youtube to play my music. I have found Roon to be an excellent program linking my two remote drives over cat6 cables. You can get it for free on a two week trial (at least that was available when I joined).

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On 12/02/2018 at 7:26 PM, PKay said:

I don't use youtube to play my music. I have found Roon to be an excellent program linking my two remote drives over cat6 cables. You can get it for free on a two week trial (at least that was available when I joined).

This is not about using youtube per se.

 

This is about understanding the memory retention problem and its dire effects on sound reproduction.

 

Youtube is something everyone can have access to and can play identical test tracks. 

 

Once the memory retention problem is understood, you can then perform similar tests on your vaunted streaming devices if it also clears out playback memories prior to every subsequent track playback.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Guest yamaha_man
1 hour ago, PKay said:

@yamaha_mannow that you have the v2 Meitner it would be appreciated to get your thoughts. 

Won't be using it for 2 to 3 months.

When I do I'll let you know if it's better than my current Auralec Vega.

Edited by yamaha_man
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  • 2 years later...

Hi,

I am considering upgrading my Weiss 202.

I am thinking of the Weiss 501 or the Meitner MA-1 V2 .

I would be grateful for any comments or advice? 

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17 minutes ago, Jventer said:

All Weiss products to me are very serious quality relative to the price point.  You get what you pay for.   Weiss make a DSP  501 and 502 without a DAC and the same  with a DAC.  The 501 is half size.  I only have the DSP 502 version without the DAC.    

I have not heard the Meitner or the 502 with DAC so I cannot say which would be better. I have the Weiss  Medus and it is just wonderful though it is considerably more expensive than the DSP 502 with DAC

John

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I now finally understood why the dac2xv2 sucked when I first received it, and why after 6 months, the sound dramatically became good in a short 48 hour period.

Edited by jeromelang
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On 26/01/2021 at 1:59 AM, jeromelang said:

I now finally understood why the dac2xv2 sucked when I first received it, and why after 6 months, the sound dramatically became good in a short 48 hour period.


Ok, I’d love to know!

 

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