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GIESELER KONVERTER (DAC/Preamp) Official release.

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Joe

yes the new DAC will definately be 2k or under. There is a lot less work in a DAC only version of the Konverter - all the Preamp section, volume control relays ect won't be needed so that will massively reduce the built time.

 

Jermain -  no - no plans to update the Klein II to the AK4497, OLED display ect. All those upgrades increase the parts cost quite a bit so the price would end up well over the thousand dollar mark. The Klein & Klein II design goal is as a maximum "bang for buck" device without the bling & I think I have achieved that. If you want a step up from say the Klein II the new DAC I'm planning will be the way to go. Upgrades over the Klein II spec will be.

 

AK4497EQ DAC chip.

Enhanced power supplies with the new ultra low regs & using the large 16v  2.5 A external transformer (same as the Konverter)

OLED display with extra functions & larger font option ( for across room viewing)

Ultra simple DAC output stage using top quality Jensen 80% nickel core transformers.

Balanced output.

Possible isolater/reclocking upgrade option for the digital section.

 

DMax -  Konverter cost is $4000 which includes delivery

 

Phew! Hopes that answers all the questions

Now time to do some work - I have Klein DAC II's, Konverter's & power supplies to build.

Also a Auralic Aries to evaluate which bhobber has kindly lent me

No rest for the wicked!

Edited by Gieseler Audio

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Hey Clay,

 

If you use a Uptone Regen, would the isolater/reclocking upgrade be necessary?

 

Regards,

 

Joe

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Hi Clay I think you will be impressed by the Auralic Aries, that's the one I'm using and I'm very impressed with not only the sound but also the lightening software which I believe is just about to get another overhaul to improve functionality and sound, a very stable program

 

make sure that the iOS device that you use is an up to date model.  I have an iPhone 6 and a second gen iPad and the iPad struggles a little to run the app where as the iPhone runs smoothly.  

 

This just shows you how sometimes products get a bad rap sometimes because the device running it is to slow for the app

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Joe,

correct - however it may perform a little better with the reclocking right at DAC point on the PCB which is where I would do it.

Ricardo maybe able to offer more info on this

 

Brian,

thanks for the tips - I have a iPad Pro so hopefully that will handle it ok.

Edited by Gieseler Audio

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Wow.. A bit of a jump in price. But it does look very awesome. :)

Sent from my SM-N915G using Tapatalk

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12 hours ago, Cardiiiii said:

If you use a Uptone Regen, would the isolater/reclocking upgrade be necessary?

 

Nothing is necessary (reclocking/isolation, Uptone Regen, etc). Assuming things are properly implemented there's just varying degrees of better. Getting a signal at the DAC IC that's as low jitter as possible is where it's at... best shot at this is dealing with the I2S signal just upstream of the DAC - properly done, this should outperform a Regen. No slight against the Regen, it is an excellent product for the price - simply that good I2S isolating/reclocking is better.

 

Implementation is key, there's a lot of stuff you can do just with clean power, circuit routing, isolation etc... and a lot else... if you trawl around for photos of various PDXs that have been on these forums, you'll find that Clay is no stranger to this journey.

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On 2017-5-3 at 9:37 AM, Cardiiiii said:

Coincidentally I read an article earlier yesterday suggesting doing exactly the same, but on my Mac I can't select both exclusive and force volume, is that a Windows only thing?

 

No.

 

I have done it on both a Mac and Windows machine.  I checked Clays DAC with MQA on a Mac.  Used Audivana 1 something or another for non MQA.

 

Things are changing rapidly though.

 

1.  Roon will do MQA decoding so Clay's new DAC with streaming may handle it.

2.  In the Mac world Audirvana now comes with MQA decoding and the next version will stream like Roon

3.  Possibly the most exciting of all is I bought one of these little beauties before they were sold out (they were on special at just $990 - couldn't resist):

https://addictedtoaudio.com.au/collections/digital/products/auralic-aries-streamer-bridge

 

Clay has it in his hot little hands right now and can report what it does with his DAC - but please give him time - he is a busy guy.

 

Its advantages are:

1.  It does full MQA decoding - not partial.  It seems Auralic had a falling out with MQA because they would not let them do the decoding in the streamer but said - **** you - we will do our own propriety decoding they think might be better.

2.  It up-samples everything either using their proprietary MQA or proprietary de-blurring algorithms to DXD.

3.  It streams Roon, Tidal etc etc.

 

I was going to get a mac and run Audirvana but this is much better and was and a drop dead price so got it instead - normally it would not be that cheap.  But the mob I got it from usually discount anyway so I doubt it will be the $2500 it usually is - but not the drop dead $990 I got it for that's all.

 

Anyway Clay can report further.  It would go great with the new $2K DAC he is proposing.

 

Just a question for Clay though.  Its USB output is clocked by a Femento clock - would that render better clocks than on your Aminero board moot?  My guess is it wont, but Clay may, just may, can do a bit of fiddling with the board ie jumpers and what not - it does allow for external clocks.  Just a thought.,

 

Thanks

Bill

Edited by bhobba

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Doesn't the Auralic have co-ax out? Wouldn't that be better than the USB?

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Guest scumbag

-

Edited by scumbag

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3 hours ago, bhobba said:

 

 

I was going to get a mac and run Audirvana but this is much better and was and a drop dead price so got it instead.

 

Thanks

Bill

 

Can you elaborate on why you think this is much better than Audirvana?

Have you heard Audirvana 3?

 

At the end of the day the buck stops with how a DAC handles what is presented to it, and am personally very very happy with MacBook > Audirvana 3 >Tidal Premium > DAC.

 

And I'm basically just talking about sound quality here, if Auralic can sound better than what I use I would consider it in the future.

 

 

 

Edited by soundfan

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3 hours ago, bhobba said:

 

1.  It does full MQA decoding - not partial.  It seems Auralic had a falling out with MQA because they would not let them do the decoding in the streamer but said - **** you - we will do our own propriety decoding they think might be better.

2.  It up-samples everything either using their proprietary MQA or proprietary de-blurring algorithms to DXD.

 

Hi Bill,

please can you provide a link to these two points.

I have not seen anything yet which would support these points.

Thanks

 

Matt

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@bhobba @soundfan

The CPU power of a Macbook is much higher than the CPU power of an Auralic Aries. The quality of the upsampling algorithms are relying to a great extent on the computing power. The best upsampling softwares like HQPlayer need a VERY powerful computer to work properly. So I can not see the point why a resource restricted Aries should be better than Audirvana which uses the CPU of a computer.

 

Matt

 

PS: Thanks  @frankn

I like VERY much that Auralic says NO to MQA. Bravo!

Edited by matth

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5 hours ago, Cardiiiii said:

Doesn't the Auralic have co-ax out? Wouldn't that be better than the USB?

 

In my experience USB with the Curios cable clobbers the coax - although the Eichman 3D cable is very very good - use it myself with the Oppo.  The other advantage of USB is it does DXD - coax doesn't.

 

Clay was with me comparing the two - the 3D and the Curios into both his DAC and a Direct Stream.   The Curios was best - slifhly bettter detail etc - more transparent - but the 3D was so analog like it seduced me so I use it because the Oppo doesnt have usb out.

 

My system is in a state of flux right now - I have some decisions to make:

 

1.   Continue to use the Oppo - but one upgraded with a Terra-firma clock.  This is the least likely because it doesn't do MQA but may use it for Home Theater duties such as listening to my TV through my stereo system.  Its what I do now with a non upgraded Oppo.

2.   The bridge 2 in my Direct Stream

3.   The Auralic.

 

I can feel  a GTG coming on gettting to the botttom of it. 

 

Thanks

Bill

Edited by bhobba

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18 hours ago, soundfan said:

Can you elaborate on why you think this is much better than Audirvana?

Have you heard Audirvana 3?

 

Haven't heard Audirvana 3.   Was going to get a Mac-book and use it, but the deal on the Auralac made me get it instead.

 

It's advantages are:

 

1.  Designed for audio from the ground up.

2.  USB and coax outputs Femento clocked

3.  It uses a power suppply that Clay thinks posssibly is as good or maybe bettter than his - it certainly is much more expensive but Clays suppply is the best I have ever come accross.

4.  Its MQA decoding is full decoding - but using Auralic's own proprietry algorithms.

 

Thanks

Bill

Edited by bhobba

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On 2017-5-6 at 6:42 PM, matth said:

please can you provide a link to these two points.

I have not seen anything yet which would support these points.

 

http://support.auralic.com/hc/en-us/articles/221252547-Beta-Firmware-Release-Notice

Adds MQA decoding support. Note: the MQA decoding method integrated by all AURALiC streaming devices has been developed solely by AURALiC using AURALiC’s proprietary resampling and de-blurring method. This process is not an MQA-created or MQA-licensed process.

 

Evidently it has similar algorithms for non MQA and everthing is upsampled to DXD to try and do similar things as MQA.

 

They are also working on making things even better which should prove interesting

 

Thanks

bill.

Edited by bhobba

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13 hours ago, matth said:

The CPU power of a Macbook is much higher than the CPU power of an Auralic Aries. The quality of the upsampling algorithms are relying to a great extent on the computing power. The best upsampling softwares like HQPlayer need a VERY powerful computer to work properly. So I can not see the point why a resource restricted Aries should be better than Audirvana which uses the CPU of a computer.

 

A DSP is going to be more computationally efficient than a CPU at upsampling in general, and FWIW there's upsampling and then there's upsampling. A fully-PCM workflow isn't that computationally strenuous. 

 

17 hours ago, bhobba said:

Its USB output is clocked by a Femento clock - would that render better clocks than on your Aminero board moot?  

 

The only clock/jitter that matters is what happens at the DAC IC - what happens upstream at the USB send side is extremely upstream of this (in asynchronous USB it's also not the clock that matters most).

 

A shame your Auralic box doesn't output I2S. This approach may be even better suited to a R2R DAC. 

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IMG_1023.thumb.JPG.01f5ed4ae4af34a029701c846c433624.JPGIMG_1029.thumb.JPG.a07bce7afbe097ccd09e3e1b20faa621.JPGIMG_1028.thumb.JPG.ee0d9afb7d35c5fa88c281bcb1e3e097.JPGFinally after a few hours of messing around & generally getting familiar with Tidal & the DS Lightning App I'm up & running.

The Konverter even displaying 192k on some music files.

Everything was playing in 44k or 48k until I joined the Auralic beta testing program & installed the very latest beta firmware.

What do I think - Wow loving it all.

Even with 44k material it sounds pretty darn good.

Is the possible MQA enhancement coming into play? - no idea

Am I a convert?  - Absolutely now I just need to get a Auralic Aries for $990!

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Clay, is that an Antipodes DX in your rack? If so, if you use Roon, what happens to Tidal playback on the Konverter?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Is there a Regen or similar device between the Ares and the DAC?

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Guest scumbag

"now I just need to get a Auralic Aries for $990!"

 

Join the club. It's not very exclusive but on the up side, membership is free.

Clay, did you end up getting an SMS200 in the end?

 

Mark

Edited by scumbag

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49 minutes ago, scumbag said:

"now I just need to get a Auralic Aries for $990!"

 

Join the club. It's not very exclusive but on the up side, membership is free.

Clay, did you end up getting an SMS200 in the end?

 

Mark

https://addictedtoaudio.com.au/products/auralic-aries-le-streamer-bridge

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17 minutes ago, scumbag said:

"LE" - no wizz bang power supply and no femto clocks.

Oh yeah.  Gotcha....

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7 hours ago, Gieseler Audio said:

IMG_1023.thumb.JPG.01f5ed4ae4af34a029701c846c433624.JPGIMG_1029.thumb.JPG.a07bce7afbe097ccd09e3e1b20faa621.JPGIMG_1028.thumb.JPG.ee0d9afb7d35c5fa88c281bcb1e3e097.JPGFinally after a few hours of messing around & generally getting familiar with Tidal & the DS Lightning App I'm up & running.

The Konverter even displaying 192k on some music files.

Everything was playing in 44k or 48k until I joined the Auralic beta testing program & installed the very latest beta firmware.

What do I think - Wow loving it all.

Even with 44k material it sounds pretty darn good.

Is the possible MQA enhancement coming into play? - no idea

Am I a convert?  - Absolutely now I just need to get a Auralic Aries for $990!

 

Hi Clayton, if you don't mind me asking how does it compare to playing the same music on CD?

 

cheers Terry

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