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clunt

Found a beautiful Encel from 1974!! now to get it singing

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There are adhesives specially designed for rubber/o-rings, eg.Loctite 406. 

I don't know how much of an improvement it is over super-glue but it's not expensive.

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Yes Loctite 406 is good if you have it but I would say most people would have some super glue around...it sticks and dries quickly.

 

Just don't glue your fingers together....:party

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15 hours ago, monaro8 said:

 

Why?

 

I think it is this...a 1.5mm round cord type belt [not the usual flat belt] sits in the pulley differently compared to a 2mm or 2.5mm thick cord type belt.

 

The pulley is also rounded inside where the belt wraps around the pulley hence a smaller belt has a smaller contact area on the pulley...a thicker belt has a larger contact area and so on.

 

 

The size of the belt,  the contact area of the belt and the length of the belt  is of no relevance to the speed of the turntable .

This is a simple law of Physics.

 

Why?

 

What you were noticing is that on a curved pulley a larger belt will not sit as low in the pulley as the correct size smaller belt.

The affect of this is to make the pulley size larger.

It is the size of the pulleys that determines the speed. How many rotations of the first pulley it takes to rotate the second pulley one turn.  

 

Making the motor pulley larger , by use of a larger thickness belt, will make the TT go faster ,as it will take fewer turns of the small pulley to turn the lager pulley one rotation.

This is the opposite affect to the one clunt is looking for.

 

I assume at $40 clunt purchased the correct size belt for the JH  pulley .

The problem is that the motor is not a proper TT motor and is not up to the job.

 

Also splicing may be ok for an o ring but the joint on a TT belt will be noticed.

I spliced a belt for a TT, just so I could test it worked before I purchased the correct belt, and although it sounded ok to me at first,  by looking at the strobe I could see every time the glued area went round the motor pulley the speed slowed slightly.

 

The tension of the belt is important , too loose and it could slip or fall off, too tight it could pull the pulley out of alignment and it could make it not possille to change speed as the belt will not easily move from one part of the pulley to the other.

 

clunt could get a better motor and platter but he would then really have a different TT   so what would be the point.

 

 

 

 

Edited by EV Cali

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Good morning you may be correct with this....

 

"Making the motor pulley larger , by use of a larger thickness belt, will make the TT go faster ,as it will take fewer turns of the small pulley to turn the lager pulley one rotation."

 

I have made at least 10 of these cord type belts myself and yes if you use too much glue it will cause a "small bump" where it meets the pulley...so make sure to use just a dab of super glue and make sure you align the joined ends precisely....this small bump may have a slight affect on the speed for a millisecond where it meets the pulley...I can not hear any difference in the music while playing.

 

All I know is that I just did a test on my Connoisseur BD1 turntable and found these speed readings>>>>

 

1.0 mm belt speed.....29.7 RPM

 

1.5mm belt speed....31.0 RPM

 

2.0mm belt speed....33.3 RPM

 
Edited by monaro8

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3 hours ago, monaro8 said:

Good morning you may be correct with this....

 

"Making the motor pulley larger , by use of a larger thickness belt, will make the TT go faster ,as it will take fewer turns of the small pulley to turn the lager pulley one rotation."

 

I have made at least 10 of these cord type belts myself and yes if you use too much glue it will cause a "small bump" where it meets the pulley...so make sure to use just a dab of super glue and make sure you align the joined ends precisely....this small bump may have a slight affect on the speed for a millisecond where it meets the pulley...I can not hear any difference in the music while playing.

 

All I know is that I just did a test on my Connoisseur BD1 turntable and found these speed readings>>>>

 

1.0 mm belt speed.....29.7 RPM

 

1.5mm belt speed....31.0 RPM

 

2.0mm belt speed....33.3 RPM

 

 

Hi monaro

If you are happy with the belts you have made that is all that matters but I would not be happy with a belt that had a slight variation in speed 33 times per minute.

 

I have no doubt you found the speed results  you mention.

As I said the thicker the belt the more it will ride out from the bottom of a curved pulley and act like a larger pulley.

But that does not mean that you should control the speed of a TT by using belts that do not fit the pulley.

 

You asked the question     it is the belt thickness...:anyone:       Why? 

 

Are you still saying that you think the likely cause of the speed difference  is  "a smaller belt has a smaller contact area on the pulley...a thicker belt has a larger contact area and so on". and not prepared to accept the reason I gave . If this is the case it is a bit strange you asked the question in the first place.

 

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Well for 8 bux, I'll give it a try, isolate which size belt will get me the right speed, then see if I can find a seamless one for the long term.

Thanks heaps for the detailed explanations, makes sense :)

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Fair comment...I really do not know Why?

 

It was just a guess...I guess :)

 

For me it means: 

 

A. I can play records on my turntable which would otherwise not be used

 

B. for a fraction of the cost of buying a manufacturer made belt...which should be better of course (unless it is playing at the wrong speed)

 

C. I can not hear any difference in the music where the glued part of the belt hits the pulley.

 

Like I said....do not use "too much glue"....just a small dab of super glue on each end of the cord....make sure you align them perfectly when joining the ends together...

 

this is made easier by using masking tape to hold down each end of the rubber cord onto a chopping board or the like, checking the joins are precise, then let it dry.

 

I used this procedure this morning and it took me 5 minutes to make a belt with a near seem less join...plays beautifully....in fact I was able to make 2 belts from the one cord purchased

 

Before gluing the ends I measured the cord length for future reference to fit that particular turntable.

 

Hope this helps other members with similar problems....:welcome:

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Thanks EV

 

Good discussion....:thumb:

 

Hopefully clunt can get the right belt made up for his turntable.

 

Let's see how it goes

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Clunt, I have a JVC QL 50 in the shed that has no arm, but the arm board is cut for your Grace arm. Speed is rock solid and it will run rings around the Encel. Happy to let it go cheap. Send me a PM if you're keen


Sent from my E5823 using Tapatalk

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Couldn't you just get a big O ring from an engineering supplier? They make them that big in different thicknesses and profiles.

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I used a big O ring for my JH   TT  as I thought it would be cheaper than an actual belt being sold specifically for the TT.

Unfortunately it was almost the same price !

So about four time more that the DIY  belt 

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I was robbed .

 

O rings appear to be the best bet then.

Can you recommend a supplier for clunt.

 

Edited by EV Cali

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Forget hardware stores. Try engineering services and supply companies, they use this stuff all the time. Companies that service large heavy duty hydraulic equipment like cranes will stock them as well. That is typically where o rings of this size are used. They stock them by the hundreds, so have the buying power to supply cheaply. One thing to be aware of though, many of them have a minimum invoice value which may be $50 or more. Cash over the counter with no invoice usually sorts this. ;) 

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