norman Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 (edited) I just got a wet record cleaner - a Knosti "disco-antistat" that is labeled as being made in Germany. It appears to be a bit similar to the "Spin Clean" (bright yellow) device but instead of scratchy velvet pads it uses camel- or goat-hair brushes. I have read that one should do a second clean in de-ionised water after the cleaner to make sure everything is gone. Anyone else used one? I am waiting to hear the first results from a really noisy copy of Tubular Bells as a test, but nothing is dry yet... Edit - couldn't find my bottle of de-ionised water so they didn't get that second treatment. Complete drying in a coolish Canberra room took about 10 minutes. The result - it seems to work perfectly. The previously un-listenable copy of (quadraphonic) Tubular Bells has become silent in terms of scratchy surface noise. No gooey residue on the stylus as some web comments suggested. I have filtered the solution using the supplied device back into its bottle. I will do a few more and report back again, and also try the second water bath, but not tonight. Edited April 26, 2016 by npeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catman Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 G'day mate, I use one and I think that it works well. Regards, Felix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jt301 Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 The only problem with the supplied cleaning liquid used in conjunction with a drip dry process is that it does tend to leave a slight residue on your albums. Doing a second rinse in distilled water helps remove the majority of the residue. It might also be worthwhile experimenting with other cleaning liquids to see if they leave less residue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Misterioso Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 I used to use it with Melody Mate without a second clean in de-ionised water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astormsau Posted April 26, 2016 Share Posted April 26, 2016 I've had one of these for about 4 years and have cleaned approx 400 LP's with it. I used various methods and have found the best results with a solution of 80% distilled water 20% iso alcohol and then a few dashes of Finish Dishwashing Booster (yellow container can be purchased at supermarket). I spin one way 8-10 turns, lift the album half way out of the trough and turn a few times to ensure the lead in groove gets cleaned, turn the other way 6-8 times and then remove and leave to dry on the stand. The record will be dry in approx 10 mins. I don't do any rinsing or drying. If there is a little drop of water on the lead in groove I use a glasses cleaning cloth to remove it. I never used the Knosti fluid as I read too many reviews complaining about residue. The method above with no rinsing or drying with towels works the best for me. Drew Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted April 27, 2016 Author Share Posted April 27, 2016 I have now cleaned 10 albums with no rinsing and all seems OK so far. I will adopt the taking out and reversing strategy as this makes great sense. I have previously made up Discwasher D4 fluid substitute (sans antibacterial poison) using the "80% / 20% / 2 drops" fluid formula above and it seems to work on that, so I will also give that formula a try. I always seem to have a drop of cleaner left on the bottom of the lead-in groove edge, so I will also use a glasses cleaner there as suggested. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astormsau Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Npeters I've found that Finish dishwashing booster fluid I mentioned to be exceptionally good and leave no marks on the record once dry. Using normal Finish used to leave marks. The booster also seems to 'wet' and dissipate better. Worth trying it if you aren't already Drew Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted April 27, 2016 Author Share Posted April 27, 2016 (edited) Thanks Drew - We've only got the blue container Finish anti-streak type wetting agent under the sink, so I will wander off and get the Yellow Booster one and give it a spin (sorry about the pun). I also have just remembered that I have an old bottle of Kodak wetting agent used for processing films I might try (used to leave silver based photographic films absolutely streak-free in Perth where the tap water was full of minerals...) I will report back. Norm Edited April 28, 2016 by npeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candyflip Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 It doesn't need to be Finish - any dishwashing liquid cleaner (1 or 2 drops) will work, and (usually) won't leave marks. I personally use 50% white vinegar, 50% distilled water as the wash for the first cycle. 100% distilled water for the rinse. Works for me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graceman Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 It doesn't need to be Finish - any dishwashing liquid cleaner (1 or 2 drops) will work, and (usually) won't leave marks. I personally use 50% white vinegar, 50% distilled water as the wash for the first cycle. 100% distilled water for the rinse. Works for me. That's a very acidic brew, even for a first wash. Make sure you rinse very thoroughly. A more neutral pH would be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okitoki Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 What is the alternative to the filter material? I bought my disco cleaner from a store display and only had a few sheet left in it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted April 28, 2016 Author Share Posted April 28, 2016 Mi disco had a funnel supplied for re-using the fluid that has a built in filter, but it's definitely not made of paper, looks like it is a permanent fitting. You can back-flush it easily with water if it gets dirty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graceman Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 (edited) What is the alternative to the filter material? I bought my disco cleaner from a store display and only had a few sheet left in it Try paper conical filters for a coffee filter machine. Edited April 29, 2016 by Graceman 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltech Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 That's a very acidic brew, even for a first wash. Make sure you rinse very thoroughly. A more neutral pH would be better. https://www.spilltech.com/wcsstore/SpillTechUSCatalogAssetStore/Attachment/documents/ccg/CBOOM.pdf according to the above linked document, vinegar does not harm PVC at 20 degrees or at 60 degrees. The sodium sulfite in finish dishwashing booster is not harmful at 20 degrees but might be at 60 degrees. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eltech Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 just a follow up to my above post. After further internet investigations it appears that white vinegar may be actually made from non brewed acetic acid. According to the document 50% acetic acid is harmful to pvc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graceman Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 just a follow up to my above post. After further internet investigations it appears that white vinegar may be actually made from non brewed acetic acid. According to the document 50% acetic acid is harmful to pvc. This might help with getting the concentration right:- There is an excellent thread on Audio Karma with the title "Record Cleaning.....You're doing it all wrong" It was begun by Vince, who is a Biochemist, though sadly after 30-odd pages, the trolling put him off and he opted out. The thread is still there and it is worth a read: http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/record-cleaning-youre-doing-it-wrong.689430/ He has this to say in response to a query about vinegar: Question..: As some others out there have probably tried in the past, I have been using a mixture of 10 parts distilled water, 2 parts white vinegar, and 1 part IPA in a spray bottle that mists. I wipe with a soft terrycloth towel in circular and then straight around the grooves. Then I rinse with the distilled water, wiping and drying in the same fashion. The records come out looking and sounding great. What do you think of this concoction and should I be concerned about using white vinegar on vinyl? Thanks for all the great information also! Response from the Biochemist: Consumer White Vinegar is acetic acid, but dilute (about 4-7%) with a pH around 2.5. As acids go, acetic is not very strong so I don't know whether it etches at the concentration you are using (less than 1%) but it really isn't necessary if you just use a detergent (detergents are better at cleaning than any vinegar). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candyflip Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 This might help with getting the concentration right:- There is an excellent thread on Audio Karma with the title "Record Cleaning.....You're doing it all wrong" It was begun by Vince, who is a Biochemist, though sadly after 30-odd pages, the trolling put him off and he opted out. The thread is still there and it is worth a read: http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/record-cleaning-youre-doing-it-wrong.689430/ He has this to say in response to a query about vinegar: Question..: As some others out there have probably tried in the past, I have been using a mixture of 10 parts distilled water, 2 parts white vinegar, and 1 part IPA in a spray bottle that mists. I wipe with a soft terrycloth towel in circular and then straight around the grooves. Then I rinse with the distilled water, wiping and drying in the same fashion. The records come out looking and sounding great. What do you think of this concoction and should I be concerned about using white vinegar on vinyl? Thanks for all the great information also! Response from the Biochemist: Consumer White Vinegar is acetic acid, but dilute (about 4-7%) with a pH around 2.5. As acids go, acetic is not very strong so I don't know whether it etches at the concentration you are using (less than 1%) but it really isn't necessary if you just use a detergent (detergents are better at cleaning than any vinegar). Ok, thank you very much. So it does no harm, but it may not actually DO anything either. Appreciate the science on this one - cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jakeyb77 Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Just cleaned about 100 old records in my disco with 80 parts distilled water and 20 parts IPA and a dash of finish booster. Works well. Didn't rinse as can't be arsed but a lot of the records came from a relative from the 70's and stink of smoke. They have all cleaned up really well and play well after drying off. Solution is cloudy as hell so I'll make a new batch and do them all again for the hell of it. Although many are 100% ok now. Filtered the solution after every 20 records. I'm no expert just providing feedback and thanks to above posters. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted May 1, 2016 Author Share Posted May 1, 2016 (edited) Back to back cleaning with Vinyl Revirginiser and Disco-Antistat - I cleaned a precious copy of This Mortal Coil's "It'll End In Tears" today using first vinyl revirginiser, which took ages and made the record visually sparkling, but didn't address some noise on my favourite track - the haunting Tim Buckley's "Song to the Siren" covered by Elisabeth Fraser. I cleaned it after that in the disco and it made it a fair bit less noisy. It wasn't static noise - I bought a brand-new anti static carbon fibre brush and made sure it was grounded after each pass, again no difference to noise. I put plenty of the cleaning polymer goo onto the surfaces for the first clean - how much does one have to "rub in" the cleaning polymer? maybe I didn't do that enough. What am I doing wrong? Is this a renowned noisy pressing? I will give it another go if I get any good suggestions. Edited May 1, 2016 by npeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candyflip Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Back to back cleaning with Vinyl Revirginiser and Disco-Antistat - I cleaned a precious copy of This Mortal Coil's "It'll End In Tears" today using first vinyl revirginiser, which took ages and made the record visually sparkling, but didn't address some noise on my favourite track - the haunting Tim Buckley's "Song to the Siren" covered by Elisabeth Fraser. I cleaned it after that in the disco and it made it a fair bit less noisy. It wasn't static noise - I bought a brand-new anti static carbon fibre brush and made sure it was grounded after each pass, again no difference to noise. I put plenty of the cleaning polymer goo onto the surfaces for the first clean - how much does none have to "rub in" the cleaning polymer? maybe I didn't do that enough. What am I doing wrong? Is this a renowned noisy pressing? I will give it another go if I get any good suggestions. Seems like it was fairly successful to me - you got a fair bit less noise out of it? Without actually *hearing* what you now have, it will be difficult for any of us to give an objective assessment of the success, and how much you might have to go. Which pressing do you have BTW? I have the original 4AD copy from the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted May 1, 2016 Author Share Posted May 1, 2016 (edited) My copy of TMC vinyl was an import, Its 4AD pressing. I can't remember where it came from pressing-wise. I bought it at 78 Records in Perth half a lifetme ago, and from memory it was an import. the cover is marked: "CAD 411 4AD Sleeves by 23 Envelope". Edited May 1, 2016 by npeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candyflip Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 Check the markings in the deadwax (the play out section) of Side A. There will be numbers and marks in there that will tell you which pressing you have. You can then match that to a site like Discogs to see which version exactly. Odds-on, you have an original UK press. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted May 2, 2016 Author Share Posted May 2, 2016 (edited) I will look tonight at the deadwax area and report back. 78 Records where I bougjht it too many years ago was (is) a fab. store when I lived in Perth pre-1984. It stocked mainly imports, so there's a good chance it will be an import. Most of my Factory albums (Joy Division / New Order etc) have inscriptions in the deadwax zones including "A Porky Prime Cut", "Here are the Young Men" and other lathe troll inscriptions. Edited May 2, 2016 by npeters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Candyflip Posted May 2, 2016 Share Posted May 2, 2016 I will look tonight at the deadwax area and report back. 78 Records where I bougjht it too many years ago was (is) a fab. store when I lived in Perth pre-1984. It stocked mainly imports, so there's a good chance it will be an import. Most of my Factory albums (Joy Division / New Order etc) have inscriptions in the deadwax zones including "A Porky Prime Cut", "Here are the Young Men" and other lathe troll inscriptions. Maybe start a new thread when you do? We are well and truly off topic here now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
norman Posted May 2, 2016 Author Share Posted May 2, 2016 To close this one off - it is marked as follows: (side 1) TOWNHOUSE MPO CAD 411 A1 (side 2) MPO CAD 411 B1 HEAVENS JUST A MEMORY AWAY Disoggs classifies this as the first UK release in 1984. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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