Building the ideal(ish) Music Server

[thewaves]

Before going down the linear PSU route, I have read that the corsair ax1500i is worth a shot, the quality is said to be as good as you will get from a switched PSU.

[realysm42]

One thing to be wary of when building an audio oc is that fans (or any moving mechanical parts) are deleterious to sound quality. So it might be cheaper but having a 'noisy' component in your box should be avoided where possible.

[thewaves]

Interesting, the ax1500i  can run with the fans switched off.

 

Conch Blowa where did that linear PSU come from?

[awty]

Hi great thread, pity most is beyond me. Just wondering if a MINIX NEO Z64 pre installed with android http://www.minix.com.hk/Products/MINIX-NEO-Z64-ANDROID-TV.html or 8.1 http://www.minix.com.hk/Products/MINIX-NEO-Z64-WIN-PC.html would do a reasonable job for around $200? Could add a PSU easy enough.

[TP1]

Hi great thread, pity most is beyond me. Just wondering if a MINIX NEO Z64 pre installed with android http://www.minix.com.hk/Products/MINIX-NEO-Z64-ANDROID-TV.html or 8.1 http://www.minix.com.hk/Products/MINIX-NEO-Z64-WIN-PC.html would do a reasonable job for around $200? Could add a PSU easy enough.

It's not ideal in that you will only be able to use USB attached drives or stream music from a NAS. Using external USB drives for storage is something we have been trying to avoid. Software choices are also limited and although it has Windows, driving windows based audio software like JRiver is usually better with a bit more horsepower under the hood of the CPU.

A better alternative for audio would be a squeezebox touch with Linear PSU.

If you don't want to build one, then Vortexbox Australia ( and others) supply pre-built music servers. They use low power boards which I think is important for minimal EMI interference but you will need to specify other requirements. Eg make sure it has a DC 12v external Jack so you can plug in a linear PSU. These can automatically rip your CD's and manage your audio library ( software is free) and used optimised for audio software.

http://www.vortexbox.com.au/wordpress/?page_id=19

[statman]

Using external USB drives for storage is something we have been trying to avoid. url]

Why?

[TP1]

Why?

USB bus on motherboard doing both input and output has the potential for more USB packet noise and possible latency issues. This is quite noticeable with something like raspberry Pi but with positive change when moving to SATA HDD with Banana Pi.

CPU load should also be lower with SATA compared to USB which is always a good thing.

[JDWest]

Has anyone compared SQ with a single SATA SSD (for both OS and library) vs. 2 separate SATA SSDs? 

...or even with one of the SSDs connected via something other than SATA or USB?

[realysm42]

Has anyone compared SQ with a single SATA SSD (for both OS and library) vs. 2 separate SATA SSDs? 

...or even with one of the SSDs connected via something other than SATA or USB?

I've not tried that, i jumped from one hdd to two separate ssds. Wouod be hard to do a quick comparison too. Still waiting for my pcie riser for the sotm card lol!

I also bought some Mushkin singke sided ram from ramcity. I inspected the labels on the stick when delivered. The spec was different, one had 2r written on it, which i was concerned about. Turns out they changed the spec of the ram! Moral of the story is check you're getting what you think you are...

Bought some Paul Pang ram in the end, which is single sided. I'll report back when it's in place.

[TP1]

Has anyone compared SQ with a single SATA SSD (for both OS and library) vs. 2 separate SATA SSDs?

...or even with one of the SSDs connected via something other than SATA or USB?

I have tried single SSD vs 2 as well as O/S on a CFAst card and SSD for music. . I didn't detect any differences in SQ and only use multiple SSD because 2TB SSD are so expensive.

[Equaliser]

You shouldn't be able to detect any sound differences because its storage media written read and written in binary. Tracking and seek time especially with Hi Res media would differentiate a bigger difference as SSD's are all round faster. 

[Gordon Macfarlane]

Just finished my initial windows based music server and dac build. So far very acceptable. Will post some details tomorrow.

[AccuTidal]

You shouldn't be able to detect any sound differences because its storage media written read and written in binary. Tracking and seek time especially with Hi Res media would differentiate a bigger difference as SSD's are all round faster.

I have tried very hard to refrain myself into this stupidity argument but can't help it bring myself to a new low level here!

Will you dare placing on the table $50k bet between me for the sound differences in the identical setup with an SSD and HDD in place? Happy to fun this gtg at Tasso's setup. The majority take away $50,000. And am not frea&3n kidding HERE!

[Equaliser]

I have tried very hard to refrain myself into this stupidity argument but can't help it bring myself to a new low level here!

Will you dare placing on the table $50k bet between me for the sound differences in the identical setup with an SSD and HDD in place? Happy to fun this gtg at Tasso's setup. The majority take away $50,000. And am not frea&3n kidding HERE!

 

Sure you pay for my plane ticket to WA. This myth has been debunked over and over again on hydrogenaudio, diyaudio and the forum where the CAPS music servers are sold. 

 

If you dare say you can hear a difference of sound quality between an SSD and hard drive, describe to me how does a hard drive make a difference in sound. Please, enlighten me. I certainly don't have golden ears.

Edited July 20, 2015 by DefQon

[AccuTidal]

Good! I can fund your one way ticket no problem! Can we confirm a $50k bet locked in?

I can also proof to you NAS will sound different to SSD too, as bonus. Note - I didn't say which sounds better but rather they will sound different from one another!

I will be back in Australia 29th July. Tasso - Do you mind assisting us with your setup and allow several to participate and be the Judge? DefQon - you can bring your own circle too, for the fairness and all will be documented in this Thread?

Please let me know?

[simondavies.sd]

Put dexa neuton star clocking devices ( no not romulun cloaking devices.... that's star trek stuff!) Into your digital devices .... get jitter ( distortion mostly responsible for nasties of digital sound) down to 10 to the minus 15 (femto ) seconds ... WILL AMAZE YOU !

Sent from my SM-P905 using Tapatalk

[Equaliser]

Good! I can fund your one way ticket no problem! Can we confirm a $50k bet locked in?

I can also proof to you NAS will sound different to SSD too, as bonus. Note - I didn't say which sounds better but rather different

Same setup with different drive or different setup with different drives?

How can you prove to me that a NAS will sound different (minus the variables of different hardware). How can you prove to me that an SSD will sound different to a mechanical hard drive using the same motherboard and etc configuration? Rather then trying to prove a point privately to me why not share it with the rest of this thread? I`ve heard a few hundred dollar music servers to 6 digit priced Boulder music servers all using different to similar configurations with mechanical and ssd configurations and have yet to hear any explainable difference of ssd vs hdd so I`am very interested in your feedback. You can enlighten this thread with your findings as I`m in the process of getting a custom $15000 music server hand built and customised by the hands of a dozen Italian virgin women.

Edited July 20, 2015 by DefQon

[AccuTidal]

DefQon - Are we not referring the identical setup, and only swapping the spin HDD to SSD via Sata with the same content? We can play the same track, identical track actually, for us all to observe.

We can use JRiver Dynamic range to verify it is the same track or you bring one of your own, no problem.

[Equaliser]

You know I have compared this before.

If I don`t hear a difference (which I won`t) then you pay me $50000. SNA admins and mods can we please have a e-contract made and documented by both myself and Chanh on said conditions and if I can`t hear a difference I walk away with Tassos complete setup or a $50k cheque from Chanh and signed by Chanh. Chanh or Tasso pays my flight ticket both ways since he openly invited me to this test and was the first to suggest it.

Kthnxbai

[AccuTidal]

Hahaha... Stop being a sm@rt a$$! It is not your to make a call! It the guests judges!

[Jventer]

Same setup with different drive or different setup with different drives?

How can you prove to me that a NAS will sound different (minus the variables of different hardware). How can you prove to me that an SSD will sound different to a mechanical hard drive using the same motherboard and etc configuration? Rather then trying to prove a point privately to me why not share it with the rest of this thread? I`ve heard a few hundred dollar music servers to 6 digit priced Boulder music servers all using different to similar configurations with mechanical and ssd configurations and have yet to hear any explainable difference of ssd vs hdd so I`am very interested in your feedback. You can enlighten this thread with your findings as I`m in the process of getting a custom $15000 music server hand built and customised by the hands of a dozen Italian virgin women.

@

I dont know if I can hear a difference, but if @@Chanh says he can - why is it an issue?

From what I have read on the forum written by him and Tasso he has a discerning ear. 

Anyway this topic is about the ideal server, please dont derail it with arguments.

[Equaliser]

I havent derailed schit mate. I merely said after Tassos post if there were to be a difference between hdd vs ssd that there shouldn't be any due to the fact that its stored as binary regardless of medium. Then chanh quoted and replied back calling my post stupid and I played along.

Maybe if you bothered re-reading what is happening here and get a sense of clue of whats going on before pointing fingers at me and suggesting I don`t derail the topic.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

[TP1]

I havent derailed schit mate. I merely said after Tassos post if there were to be a difference between hdd vs ssd that there shouldn't be any due to the fact that its stored as binary regardless of medium. Then chanh quoted and replied back calling my post stupid and I played along.

Maybe if you bothered re-reading what is happening here and get a sense of clue of whats going on before pointing fingers at me and suggesting I don`t derail the topic.

Sent from my LG-D855 using Tapatalk

I wish it were true that SSD provided no better SQ than a spinning drive but that is not my experience , nor that of companies like Antipodes. Of course there are so many other variables at play but there does seem to be some consistency with faster access times for operating system and data leading to improved SQ. just look at the path taken with windows servers . Everything from Audiophile Optimizer through to 2 PC setups is designed to give less inhibited access to software and music files. SSD helps with this too.

There is a simple test to try if you have the right gear. If your software can access music files from an external hard drive, starting with a USB powered spinning drive you can compare it to an external USB powered SSD playing the same music files. The only thing being compared here is the drive type for music even though it should also impact the performance of player software.

Edited July 20, 2015 by Tasso

[Equaliser]

If we are talking about the miniscule amount of difference, I preferred 2 WD Raptor X's in RAID 0 on my old music server to my Samsung 840 ssd.

 

If anything I focus on the power supply of the server, it's night and day difference but there is no good pc psu's out there for music servers. The Paul Hynes stuff is extremely expensive and not small enough to fit into a case.

[Guest myrantz]

Rather then trying to prove a point privately to me why not share it with the rest of this thread? 

To be fair that's kindda what this thread is about, Tasso and Chanh are sharing what they have done so far, in the hopes others can read and try it out themselves and make up their own mind...

 

If you disagree, I guess it's ok too. But IMO you didn't do it right - your problem is you disagreed with disrespect.. And in a way that is really condescending.. Tasso and Chanh has and will continue to put a lot of thought and effort into this CA.

 

Your disrespect dismissed all their efforts and in a way is implying they are wasting their time (and money)... 

 

FWIW, via USB, with that SoTOM SATA filter over a HDD I honestly don't think I can tell a difference over a SSD, but without it, who knows? I don't know, let's see who can do what on the day..  Since I don't have $50 k, I'm not going to participate . Given the pressure of $50 k (a huge sum to me), I will be so pressured I will be crippled to do anything really. I'm glad I never get caught in these situations now as I learned that knowing I'm right is far more important than proving I'm right..

But just in case this is happening, do let me know as I wanna be present as I assume there will be $100 k on the table somewhere with two armed security guards and the winner takes all   . I've honestly never seen that much money up close before (I wonder how big a stack it will be really)..

 

 

If you and chanh wanna do this, (and assuming Tasso agreed), at least do the right thing and pay for your own flights here. If you're right, you'd zip in and out of Perth and walk away with $50 k extra, and maybe ridiculed chanh too.. All in a few short hours... That should be incentive enough. Given such overwhelming conditions, it's really ridiculous to ask chanh to cover for your return ticket, especially after he has graciously offered to pay half your costs. That is something he doesn't need to do and you again showed contempt by your ridiculous demands... You want to walk away with Tasso's system? Seriously I doubt you can even make it down the stairs... I'm amazed myself Tasso can manhandle those speakers, I can't do that with my sore back. And the greed of it all. Disappointing to see.

 

Anyway, I only have 2 c to put on the table and that's it... I'd be back to lurking as I'm very interested in this thread (I deliberately not post in this thread as I don't want it derailed).. Keep up the good work Tasso+Chanh..