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Ultra HD Blu-ray (4K) Spec set

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:) al   

Well, looks like finally the Ultra HD Blu-ray (4K) Spec has been set as announced by the Blu-ray Diac Association (BDA) 

 

http://www.cnet.com/au/news/ultra-hd-blu-ray-specification-now-complete-logo-unveiled/

uhd-blu-ray.jpg

 

The Blu-ray Disc Association (BDA) has announced the Ultra HD Blu-ray (4K) specification is now complete and has also revealed the next-gen format's official logo.

The new disc format promises the incorporation of the latest video standards, and players will also be backward-compatible with existing Blu-ray discs.

The BDA says the format incorporates a 3,840x2,160-pixel resolution, expanded color range support, high dynamic range (HDR) and high frame rate content (read 60fps). As well as the promise of up-to-date video, UHD Blu-ray will also support "next-generation immersive, object-based sound formats."

The BDA has yet to expand on which specific standards will be supported as for each of these features there are a number of competing options: for example there are two object-based sound formats -- DTS:X and Dolby Atmos. However, a spokesperson for the BDA said that specific audio support is optional and not mandatory so "if it's on the disc it's passed through".

In addition UHD Blu-ray will bring with it the Ultraviolet-like "digital bridge" feature that will allow consumers to "view their content across the range of in-home and mobile devices."

The association has announced it will begin licensing Ultra HD Blu-ray products this summer.

Panasonic was the first company to announce a prototype Ultra HD Blu-ray player at this year's CES, and consumers can expect to see players hit the market by the end of 2015.

 

 

 

with ultra hd (4K) products being licensed from next month, thats pretty encouraging since will mean expect to see discs, players displays and other products supporting come Cedia in october this year for launch later in the year and CES early next year :)

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Been waiting since 2011 and expected it to be in full swing 2013. Haven't invested in a proper multi-channel set up since.

 

Keen to upgrade the whole system to a 4K - Dolby Atmos and a 80+inch TV/Projector when I can complete the system under $10k ex speakers. I am guessing that will be >24 months after consumer release. 

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joz   

As much I think it will all be wonderful, I can't see myself jumping early for this one.I may just let the dust settle first.

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Always good to let them revise any shortcomings after any new tech comes out. Worst thing is when they release new gear and down the track, you find you'll need adapters to get the most out of it.

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nothing1   

the problem is that most 4k TV's available at the moment will not be able to display the ultra hd blu-ray in it native form and will only pass a 1080p picture to the TV due to the fact that the TV will have to have hdcp 2.2 to display the ultra hd content, i can see many people fuming when they realize that the new  ultra hd tv they bought does not play this new format in it's native form, ouch.

Edited by nothing1

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Newman   

What percentage of video data has to be 'lost' (compressed) to fit a 3 hour movie onto one BD at 4K and 60 fps? While leaving space for 7.1 lossless 24/96 audio (ignoring Atmos)?

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And no point getting the hardware without the content to play on it and definitely if the hardware is not backward compatible with earlier software... I suspect that full HD is good enough for most people so I suspect this to fill a niche market only. I may be surprised, though.

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What percentage of video data has to be 'lost' (compressed) to fit a 3 hour movie onto one BD at 4K and 60 fps? While leaving space for 7.1 lossless 24/96 audio (ignoring Atmos)?

The UHD Blu-Ray spec allows for up to four 25Gb layers - 100Gb on a single disc so there will be plenty of room for all the content.  The HEVC, aka H.265 compression CODEC is also a leap ahead in terms of image preservation vs compression

Edited by Lil Caesar

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joz   

And no point getting the hardware without the content to play on it and definitely if the hardware is not backward compatible with earlier software... I suspect that full HD is good enough for most people so I suspect this to fill a niche market only. I may be surprised, though.

 

The manufacturers are cutting back on FHD displays and are offering more UHDs, next year there will be even less FHDs to choose from.

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What percentage of video data has to be 'lost' (compressed) to fit a 3 hour movie onto one BD at 4K and 60 fps? While leaving space for 7.1 lossless 24/96 audio (ignoring Atmos)?

 

No more than the existing bluray disc standard.

 

Ultra uses the newer (HEVC) extension to MPEG4 which is much more efficient.

 

The existing 50GB discs can handle up to 80 odd megabits .... and up to 128mbps for the newer disc sizes which are coming.

Edited by davewantsmoore

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The manufacturers are cutting back on FHD displays and are offering more UHDs, next year there will be even less FHDs to choose from.

Yep, it doesn't make sense to have a product for every consumer so they fit us all into what they think the masses will buy. A few years ago people were saying the same about how all the new TVs will have 3D and yet antipathy abounds regarding that 'feature'. I'm with Dave I don't give any shits about resolution but dynamic range I do care about. I recently bought a new FHD TV (last Nov) hopefully in 4 or 5 years time when I'm due for an upgrade panels will have improved in more than just resolution and I can buy something for equivalent of approx 1500+inflation-exchange rate. My old 40in 720p TV lasted 8 years before being relegated to secondary TV duties, so I think my chances are pretty good.

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:) al   

Yep, it doesn't make sense to have a product for every consumer so they fit us all into what they think the masses will buy. A few years ago people were saying the same about how all the new TVs will have 3D and yet antipathy abounds regarding that 'feature'. I'm with Dave I don't give any shits about resolution but dynamic range I do care about. I recently bought a new FHD TV (last Nov) hopefully in 4 or 5 years time when I'm due for an upgrade panels will have improved in more than just resolution and I can buy something for equivalent of approx 1500+inflation-exchange rate. My old 40in 720p TV lasted 8 years before being relegated to secondary TV duties, so I think my chances are pretty good.

 

yes well if think about it, most people dont even watch their TVs to fully resolve HDTV, a SD TV will likely be quite adequate for size of TV vs distance watched at. yet SDTVs went the way of the dodo and havent been able to buy for a long time.

 

same will likely happen with UHD. it will become the defacto standard whether people need it or can get best off. expanded colour range support and higher dynamic range is what most people will be buying UHD for. atleast now we have a spec/standard for it. so will start to see players, displays, AVRs/processor and source material now that fully support it.

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How many people at the present time, watch any TV and think to themselves, "I really need to spend 8 grand upwards to get the latest viewing technology so that I can watch all of the crap on TV now and into the future, in at least 4 times the resolution that I currently watch all of that crap" ? I see Ultra High Definition as a marketing ploy by the companies that wish to push this technology onto people so that they can get a highly profitable return from spending so much money of their own over the past couple of years in development and refinement of this useless technology.

 

Until the quality of content available to watch on TV changes, I don't see anyone rushing out to embrace this technology any time soon. From the figures available on the internet about total sales volumes worldwide, for UHD/4K/8K etc, there doesn't exactly seem to be a huge demand for this technology within the broader community. The gaming industry is full of people who have been forecasting a surge in recent years in the interest for 4K content, yet very few gaming pc setups can host 4K content without lag being an issue or ageing hardware that does not have the resources to tackle it well enough. 

 

Sure, you will have early adopters that will have the spending power and desire to get these sets but until the content improves they will be in the minority. For example, regarding streaming times needed for any ultra high definition content in the Australian market, I see this as a missed opportunity to improve content now rather than hope that content will improve into the future, with the addition of televisions that are able to show much higher resolutions on them of the same uninteresting crap. I know that movies look amazing on a massive screen in a cinema, but can that experience be truly replicated onto an UHD/4K/8K screen to warrant so many people to make that upgrade choice?

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:) al   

its not about TV. very unlikely we will get UHD TV, yeesh lucky enough if we get 1080 HDTV. its been all about multichanneling and variety of content actually rather than the quality of it which has been few and far between. there are a few good shows but thats about it. so no it won't be free to air TV that will be UHD,

 

UHD spec is really driven by the 4K blu-ray format, not TV. and its not just 4K the prime benefit is likely as mentioned in the original quote higher dynamic range, wider colour range. both of which with capable TV will be quite noticeable regardless of screen size or viewing distance.

 

the old saying build it and they will come. thats what is happening here, as iwht previous formats. like DVD and blu-ray. the format once specd will bring TV, player and other delivery means. and the content :)

 

as to replicating the cinema experience ? you can do that now and some would argue do an even better job at home for both audio and video. its not about a massive screen. its the immersive experience which is possible with the right size screen for viewing distance …e.g. to THX spec for immersion and your there :)

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joz   

Lets face it, UHD is no value to the FTA crowd. Just like FHD.

These panels are for either the enthusiast or the must have the latest gadget dude.

 

The FTA stations have used their bandwidth for multiple broadcasts and not thought about transmission quality.

It will not change!

 

As last seasons panels were being run out they were at about $1000 for 55-60" LEDs

So not much margin for either the manufacturer or retailer, new tech is primarily about building bigger margins.

Their job is to keep the prices up.

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Any word from poor Toshiba about a possible Ultra HD DVD revival? I really think they should give it another go because I love my HD-DVDs lmao

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I agree with most of what has been said here: the new whizz-bang marketing feature is just that. I am not altogether sure that UHDTV will go anywhere. Bluray never came close to the market that DVDs had for a variety of reasons, one of them being download and most younger people today think it is ancient technology having to have a "thing" to store your software (music, films, games) on.

 

Perhaps the idea of UHD is to tell people to buy the discs because that is the only way to get the "true experience the director intended" as downloading such files will be next to impossible. Especially with the infrastructure Australia's chosen NBN uses... UHDTV could well become the de-facto standard - the market buys what it is given - but I am just hoping my ancient, tiny (38", iirc, but big enough for me for the last 7 years and the foreseeable) flat screen full HD Panasonic will last a fair few more years yet and the hardware market will have settled down into realistic prices. And no 3D crap. :thumb:

Edited by audiohobbs

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Newman   

I don't know why we care what Joe Blow wants in a TV set. This is a Home Theatre forum. It's for enthusiasts.

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astr0b0y   

Agreed @@Newman. I've just recently upgraded my receiver and TV with great improvement and look forward to doing it again in a couple of years when UHD with HDR is all about us.

I think there is a chance for UHD OTA broadcasts - the current MPEG-2 bollox we are fed was old before it was implemented here - even NZ has MPEG-4 DVT-B! However I think on demand streaming is the way of the future and will kill most of the broadcasters traditional formats. Streaming will be all UHD pretty soon.

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Newman   

As long as the streaming is buffered so I can watch an entire program with insufficient internet speed without breakup.

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