Sony vs LG

[betty boop]

I keep saying going bigger in these screens will only make stuff more obvious ... telly inadequacies and source material inadequacies.

 

source material things like blu-ray especially pristine stuff like transformers can assure you can push to pretty big screens without issue watching at THX immersion i.e. in your 2.5-3x screen heights. so i doubt source is issue

 

things like what you describe re with the bike nd light pole is classic LCD tvs...

 

theres a guy on another forum saying atleast with his old plasma he wasnt seeing 3 cricket balls going across the screen   

 

below is his original post by the way,

Quote

 

Posted December 29, 2016 (edited) · 

I've followed this forum slavishly for about ten years now but haven't posted for about 4.  Bought my first Fujitsu (US) plasma through a group buy organised on this forum back in 2005, my Aventage A-2000 from a fellow member, my Oppo 103 on a recommendation here and bought my current 51" Samsung 8000 series plasma based on the forum's recommendation a few years ago.

Of all things, I'm in the lucky position now of having my wife agitating to buy a bigger panel this year.  I've (not surprisingly) arrived at the conclusion that it's the LG OLED, 9000 series Samsung or top of the line Sony, in either 55" or 65".  I sit 3 metres away from the display in a large, bright room.

So today I went in to compare panel performance at the local HN.  Usefully, they had the LG and Samsung side-by-side (albeit a 55" LG and a 65" Samsung) and both were playing the 9'HD' stream of the cricket.  I stood back 3 metres and what I saw was truly, truly awful.

On both displays, as soon as the ball was it with any force into the outfield you actually saw three balls rolling across the turf and some awful ghosting.  The Samsung looked like they'd used Vaseline on the camera around the players - all the players had this dull smudging about a cm thick outlining them.  And the LG had terrible banding whenever they showed the outfield - it looked more like stripes than colour gradations.

I spoke to the salesman who approached me.  I said it had been a few years since I'd looked at panels and it appeared that 50" was still the sweet spot for free to air sport given what I was seeing, describing the artefacts that were obvious on his two top of the line panels.  He just agreed and said "yep". I asked if the Sony was any better and he said "nup".  So, outstanding salesmanship there.

So my question is this - from those who own these panels and have ditched the shop settings and calibrated them properly, is this the best result I'm going to get from a $3k best of breed panel these days at anything above 50 inches?  Are they not capable now of doing a better job with a crappy Australian signal and bitrate?  

Would welcome views.

gregj23

 

 

below is one suggestion and taking the sony into account, particularly with the motion..... and he has a solution....

Quote

 

Posted January 24 ·

I found myself in a dilemma when my 65 inch pana VT50 died.

Long story short - potentially look for a second hand plasma.

I claimed mine under warranty and ended up with the sony 65 inch X9000B. Overall I was quite dissapointed. Motion wasn't actually a concern for me on it. I like sport as well and I found it quite impressive with the motion handling. The big problem though was the 'depth' for me, along with backlight bleed and off axis viewing.

I was frantically searching for second hand plasmas, as the sony just didn't draw me in like the pana did. I was lucky and came across a factory seconds samsung F8500 plasma. Ended up purchasing it and took the sony back for store credit (which is now sitting as a new fridge :-D).

The F8500 is superb. Although I could only grab the 60 inch, I still think it FAR outweighs the sony. And was 3 times cheaper!

 

Second had isn't without risk though, but I'm sure there are some buys out there for bargain prices and may just be worth the gamble...

 

 

[husq2100]

But I'm comparing this new LG LCD to my old Sony LCD

 

now if the LG was entry level I'd might accept it but this is their TOL 60" without going OLED

 

 

[betty boop]

4 minutes ago, husq2100 said:

But I'm comparing this new LG LCD to my old Sony LCD

 

now if the LG was entry level I'd might accept it but this is their TOL 60" without going OLED

 

 

 

you've gone quite a bit up in size 46 to 60" and issues will just be more obvious. thts not to suggest the LG LCD hasnt got its own issues....

[husq2100]

ok, went to JB, they were very helpful. My next step is to call LG while infront of the tv and see if we can sort it through settings. I took my Transformers BR into JB and we watched it through a 75" LG same series as my 60" .... same issues! We tried a few setting changes but not much luck. Hence the advice to go straight to LG. They also played it through a Samsung 6 series 60", same issues but were able to clear it up a fair bit through settings. The Sony x9300D in 55" looked to have similar issues as my LG . We didnt try adjusting settings on the Sony yet as I have to exhaust the LG options. At this stage they are happy for me to return the LG for exchange on another make/model (price dependant of course) or possably a refund?

 

Ill keep you all posted.

 

thanks for the help thus far

 

Serg

[betty boop]

hmmm good move taking disc in and that jb are being so helpful ! sounds like on your way to hopefully get to a better place. interesting to hear whats visible on the sony and LG can be sorted on the sammy ? wiht its settings

 

what is the particulars transformers disc and what is the time stamp of the lamp post ? something i and others can check on our various displays 

 

ps I also wonder how much of it related to the players as well. if playing on 4k display will come back to upscaler in the player or display often this and of thing some of it can cause strange things in movement.

[Jliang70]

4 hours ago, Metamatic said:

 

So please enlightenment  us with your wisdom.

 

Most of the panels like those from Panasonic, Sony or Samsung have decent video processing, they are hardly class leading.  If you want to get class leading video processing try to get it from the source end,  not the on board processing of a TV.  Sony and Panasonic have good in house calibration which means out of box their default setting are much closer to be accurate (base on ISF measurement),  Samsung's default setting are generally off and they do require calibration to get the best out of them.  I have used both computer and standalone video processor to perform the video processing duties and from what I can see the difference is obvious even on a 55 inch UHD.  Video processing do require some computational power and that is where computers and video processor ( which is just a computer running on its own operating system) have the advantage over TV.  With computer you can change your video processing algorithm and that is way above what TV can do.   A lot of AVR, bluray player or even UHD players claim to have the latest video processing chip on board however it is one part of the story having those chip onboard but having the chip programmed utilizing the processing power makes a lot of difference.

[metal beat]

31 minutes ago, Jliang70 said:

 

Most of the panels like those from Panasonic, Sony or Samsung have decent video processing, they are hardly class leading.  If you want to get class leading video processing try to get it from the source end,  not the on board processing of a TV.  Sony and Panasonic have good in house calibration which means out of box their default setting are much closer to be accurate (base on ISF measurement),  Samsung's default setting are generally off and they do require calibration to get the best out of them.  I have used both computer and standalone video processor to perform the video processing duties and from what I can see the difference is obvious even on a 55 inch UHD.  Video processing do require some computational power and that is where computers and video processor ( which is just a computer running on its own operating system) have the advantage over TV.  With computer you can change your video processing algorithm and that is way above what TV can do.   A lot of AVR, bluray player or even UHD players claim to have the latest video processing chip on board however it is one part of the story having those chip onboard but having the chip programmed utilizing the processing power makes a lot of difference.

 

 

I said Sony has the best picture processing of any other tv manufacturer.  This is a known fact, but you seem to know better.

 

You  have rambled for 30 lines without any detail whatsoever.   Please provide some examples of this superior picture

processing

 

Thanks

Edited February 3, 2017 by Metamatic

[husq2100]

10 hours ago, al said:

hmmm good move taking disc in and that jb are being so helpful ! sounds like on your way to hopefully get to a better place. interesting to hear whats visible on the sony and LG can be sorted on the sammy ? wiht its settings

 

what is the particulars transformers disc and what is the time stamp of the lamp post ? something i and others can check on our various displays 

 

ps I also wonder how much of it related to the players as well. if playing on 4k display will come back to upscaler in the player or display often this and of thing some of it can cause strange things in movement.

 

Hi Al,

 

Transformers #1 Blu-ray. I cant time stamp atm, but if you chapter search, its right at the begining of a chapter, mid way through id say. Where Bumble bee (still old school crappy camaro) drives off by himself in the night. Sam wakes up and takes chase. Watch Sam as he runs through the house down to his bike, then,  particular attention to him grabbing his push bike and swinging it around. Also as he rides off and they give a side on shot, you can see the shadowy blur around his perimeter and then the tree and lamp post distort into him...

 

The exact same problems could be seen through out "Avengers" #1 blu-ray when I flicked through it this morning at home.

 

This was easily seen on all 3 brands by myself and the 2 staff. Im sure there will be some ability to clean up on any of them, just the staff memeber was best at using the Samsung remote and menu

 

I have no idea what machine they played my BR disc on? But mine is a 8 year old Sony. probably their top or 2nd top of line at the time.

 

I have KORDZ hdmi cables if that means anything lol

 

BTW, the coment regarding "depth" in one of the posts you quoted is so true. The brightness and colours have IMO compromised the depth of field viewing in modern tvs

 

like I said, IMO, the settings look fake, even  in simple room settings...IF gaming is driving the market then maybe there is a effort to make thing more game like? or maybe even worse....are we in the dark ages of the matrix??

Edited February 3, 2017 by husq2100

[CatsWiskas]

This is 100% a setup issue within the settings menus of your new TV there will be some extra processing enabled somewhere that is making it look that way.

[betty boop]

47 minutes ago, husq2100 said:

 

Hi Al,

 

Transformers #1 Blu-ray. I cant time stamp atm, but if you chapter search, its right at the begining of a chapter, mid way through id say. Where Bumble bee (still old school crappy camaro) drives off by himself in the night. Sam wakes up and takes chase. Watch Sam as he runs through the house down to his bike, then,  particular attention to him grabbing his push bike and swinging it around. Also as he rides off and they give a side on shot, you can see the shadowy blur around his perimeter and then the tree and lamp post distort into him...

 

The exact same problems could be seen through out "Avengers" #1 blu-ray when I flicked through it this morning at home.

 

This was easily seen on all 3 brands by myself and the 2 staff. Im sure there will be some ability to clean up on any of them, just the staff memeber was best at using the Samsung remote and menu

 

I have no idea what machine they played my BR disc on? But mine is a 8 year old Sony. probably their top or 2nd top of line at the time.

 

I have KORDZ hdmi cables if that means anything lol

 

BTW, the coment regarding "depth" in one of the posts you quoted is so true. The brightness and colours have IMO compromised the depth of field viewing in modern tvs

 

like I said, IMO, the settings look fake, even simple in room settings...IF gaming is driving them market then maybe there is a effort to make thing more game like? or maybe even worse....are we in the dark ages of the matrix??

 

will dig out the transformers disc and have a peep over the weekend husq

[husq2100]

55 minutes ago, CatsWiskas said:

This is 100% a setup issue within the settings menus of your new TV there will be some extra processing enabled somewhere that is making it look that way.

 

Hopefully! But why are they ALL like this out of the box?

 

And I am having similar, though less pronounced, problems with FTA...

[Jliang70]

2 hours ago, Metamatic said:

 

 

I said Sony has the best picture processing of any other tv manufacturer.  This is a known fact, but you seem to know better.

 

You  have rambled for 30 lines without any detail whatsoever.   Please provide some examples of this superior picture

processing

 

Thanks

 

No, it doesn't.  It has better out of box picture but that is down to how well they are calibrated in the factory and their default setting is more accurate than a Samsung or LG.  I know there are difference between video processing of different brand but none of these actually stand out from one another when you have them calibrated.  I uses computer to do video processing and also used no less than 6 different standalone video processors from the early day of line doubling , 1080p and all the way to present day 4k video processor .   This is pretty much like asking how do you describe speaker A sounds better than speaker B scenario,   exactly the same with TV you see it you know it, with video processing you only noticed it when the video processor or the computer is no longer in your video chain.

Edited February 3, 2017 by Jliang70

[greigw]

Can you compare disc against a blue ray rip of the same movie played via usb?

[husq2100]

1 hour ago, greigw said:

Can you compare disc against a blue ray rip of the same movie played via usb?

 

I don't know anyone with bluray or even the ability to rip one. It did it on Avengers as well... these BR were fine last time played on the old Sony

[greigw]

Okay. I was just wondering if the BR player is causing the effects, but as it was fine with the old sony then you're most likey right, it's probably the newer tvs. Big shame none of the tvs you tried past the test. Can you remember how your old sony was calibrated and can you replicate that on the newer models in the store?

 

Was HDR activated? 

 

 

 

P.S. A few months ago I bought an LG but with IPS panel. Fabulous remote and UI, but crappy picture and sound quality. So i swapped it for a Samsung LCD which has a comparatively crappy UI and remote (but still fine in use) but better picture and sound. 

[husq2100]

I never adjusted anything on the old Sony KDL-46XBR45. It ran great straight out of the box. 

 

So I can't say what it's settings were on sorry.

[husq2100]

Chapter 7/23 on Transformers for those wanting to have a look 

[Jliang70]

44 minutes ago, husq2100 said:

I never adjusted anything on the old Sony KDL-46XBR45. It ran great straight out of the box. 

 

So I can't say what it's settings were on sorry.

 

I never calibrate my display until about 7 years ago and I started using pc and video processors in 2007. Basically when I thought about calibrating a display I wanted to find out why a lot of people on different forum were talking about display calibration and wanted to know how much better a calibrated display could look in my own home.  I think it is a decision I never regret.

[RoHo]

Soap opera effect? Here

[husq2100]

1 hour ago, RoHo said:

Soap opera effect? Here

 

I think that's part of it. I played around some more last night. Got it about the best I can without help. Looking ok, still a little unsure. I'm concerned for sport like UFC. Watched a little of the WAFL and it was pretty bad (picture)...

 

there are are a lot of options to adjust and like anything the combinations endless. I have to call LG and see if the can better it

 

better write down my settings first!

[husq2100]

Played around a little more...

 

Spoke with LG support, and apart from the language barrrier, they were helpful. Maybe another person with more knowledge of individual settings and their relation to other settings as a whole could get a better result, but at the end of the day I still was a bit unsure.

 

I went back to JB and watched my Transformers BR on the Sony x9300 55" again. IMO its better without changing the settings, that is better standard than I could get the LG changing settings to my eyes.

 

Dont get me wrong, the LG is a great TV, just what I was seeing I wasnt happy with. I will be taking a backward step sound and size wise with the Sony. I have a HT amp and speakers to take care of the sound.

 

I will be swapping the LG for the Sony this week.

 

Ill let you all know how I go....

[metal beat]

I won't rub it in and say I told you so 

 

Good end result and I am sure you will be happy.

 

This is why many are salivating at Sony releasing OLED this year.   Because Sony know how get a good picture with their superior picture processing, including seemingly simple things like motion.

 

Cheers

[husq2100]

TBH, if you dont ask the shop to play free to air or a dvd/blu-ray its very hard to tell. Each brand has its "ideal content" on a usb stick plugged into their range of tvs to get the best out of them. In other words, not apples for apples across brands..... In fact I was lucky there was a lonely LG 850 series out of the LG area on the main circut as they had no way of playing my BR on the LGs otherwise....

 

thanks for the help guys/girls

[Jliang70]

5 hours ago, husq2100 said:

Played around a little more...

 

Spoke with LG support, and apart from the language barrrier, they were helpful. Maybe another person with more knowledge of individual settings and their relation to other settings as a whole could get a better result, but at the end of the day I still was a bit unsure.

 

I went back to JB and watched my Transformers BR on the Sony x9300 55" again. IMO its better without changing the settings, that is better standard than I could get the LG changing settings to my eyes.

 

Dont get me wrong, the LG is a great TV, just what I was seeing I wasnt happy with. I will be taking a backward step sound and size wise with the Sony. I have a HT amp and speakers to take care of the sound.

 

I will be swapping the LG for the Sony this week.

 

Ill let you all know how I go....

 

Unfortunately with LG or Samsung you will need to change the settings.  This is particularly true with their default setting are off the chart with greyscale measurement, you will need more than your eyes to get them right. 

[Satanica]

I just returned a 65inch Sony X8500D for an LG OLED65B5T. The Sony was 54% of the price but pretty awful with terrible blacks, inconsistent blacks with light bleeds on the side and a green tinge across the top two inches and a bit around all sides. The LG OLED was expensive but is just amasing at producing a picture and the sound is huge improvement as well.

Edited February 13, 2017 by Satanica