15 replies to this topic

[Chisel73]

Hi All,
I have just purchased Yamaha RX-3010 Receiver, that is running 2 front Focal Chorus 716V (200w) and one center CC700 (120w) speakers, with the intention to add a Focal sub and rear speakers later on. I am very happy with this combination, it sounds fantastic!

I do have a couple of small issues with the combination that hopefully someone can help me with?

The first problem
At high volume the receiver will cut out (full power shut down) the shut down will vary on what source has been selected (CD/DVD or the Yamaha doc) volume around +04 dB this shut down will accrue hot or cold. I can get to max volume +16dB when playing vinyl, with the pure direct button selected (stereo mode)

The second problem
When I plug my I phone into the Yamaha/I phone doc a fault will come up on my phone “I-tunes does not support this device” and will not allow the music to play.
I am not sure if this is a Yamaha fault or an I phone fault, I have updated the phone and the phone will play on other devices.

Thanks

[Grumpy]

sounds like a set-up problem re - the shut down. It is protecting itself by doing that.
+4 and + 16 sounds like the master volume setting; if not you are cranking the volume up WAY to much and you shouldn't have to go that high. Maybe the Focals are a bad match for that receiver, but Yamaha usually handle tough loads well.
Have you double checked your wiring and the set-up manual?

Edited by Grumpy, 25 July 2012 - 11:54 AM.

[Chisel73]

Thanks, I thought the Yamaha may have some sought of protection built into it, but did not know if it was shutting down due to speaker overload or the receiver was drawing too much power, but I would not of thought so, as I am only using two of the nine channels (in stereo).

I will check the wiring when I get home next week.

Cheers

[Ozcall]

Geez Chisel,playing at those sort of volumes with such relatively efficient speakers will damage your hearing and probably the speakers too.
What size is your listening room?

[Chisel73]

It is a big room 70m2, and I live on a big block in the bush. I don't have the volume up that high all the time, I am testing the new system out , and it p**s me that it's cutting out. The speakers don't seem to destort at all

[Arg]

It's cutting out because of digital clipping. When (volume setting) + (input level at any particular freq) + (sum of EQ settings at same freq) = more than zero, that is digital clipping. The 3010 will be monitoring this internally and treating it as an overload condition. It is nothing to do with power or distortion or overheating; it is just digital numbers getting too big.

First place to check (to fix the above) is the sub. Look at the EQ curve for the sub; is it significantly positive at any frequencies? Is the sub's overall gain set to positive? If so, the easiest fix (do this anyway) is to turn down the 3010's subwoofer channel gain A LOT, and turn the gain up on the sub's external power amp by the same amount.

Now you will have small signal levels through the 3010 and more gain in the sub plate amp.

The problem could be (the same thing) occuring on the other channels, but try the sub first, an easy fix.

[Time_Lord]

It sounds like to me you are pushing your amp to hard. have you considered using a external power amp.

[joz]

Have you checked what the auto setup has done?
The receiver may have set max volume 0db on the dial to 75dbSPL,
You may have to manually set the channel outputs?

[atty]

Have you played around with the ypao and set the speakers to small? reason low freq require more power than highs.

[Arg]

It's cutting out because of digital clipping. When (volume setting) + (input level at any particular freq) + (sum of EQ settings at same freq) = more than zero, that is digital clipping. The 3010 will be monitoring this internally and treating it as an overload condition. It is nothing to do with power or distortion or overheating; it is just digital numbers getting too big.

First place to check (to fix the above) is the sub. Look at the EQ curve for the sub; is it significantly positive at any frequencies? Is the sub's overall gain set to positive? If so, the easiest fix (do this anyway) is to turn down the 3010's subwoofer channel gain A LOT, and turn the gain up on the sub's external power amp by the same amount.

Now you will have small signal levels through the 3010 and more gain in the sub plate amp.

The problem could be (the same thing) occuring on the other channels, but try the sub first, an easy fix.

Hi Chisel73, have you had a chance to try any of the suggestions you received yet? I'm curious as to what is the cause of your amp's behaviour.

[Chisel73]

Sorry Arg, I haven’t had a chance yet I work out of town.

I have read your response and I am keen to try it out.

When I return home I will order a sub and I will try your suggestion and I let you know what I find.

Thanks for the follow up.

[Ozcall]

Yep , a good sub will take some of the load off the poor amp.
The Rythmic subs are great for music and movies and there is now an Ozzy distributor : http://www.audiosalo...u/About_Us.html
Best bit is they are comparitively inexpensive for the performance.

Edited by Ozcall, 10 August 2012 - 04:59 PM.

[rantan]

It is cutting out because it lacks sufficient current to drive the Focals properly. Focal speakers have a known impedance dip to about 3 ohms in the mid bass and when the not -so-powerful amplifier gets cranked as is the case here and sees this impedence dip, it just doesn't have the current to do anything so it shuts down.

Many people make the mistake of using Focals with lower powered amplifiers because they are nominally quite efficient, but they are a b i t c h to drive [ for reasons stated above ] and only high current designs should be used with them.

A sub might help, but a new and better amplifier is the real answer.

Edited by rantan, 10 August 2012 - 06:08 PM.

[Ozcall]

It is cutting out because it lacks sufficient current to drive the Focals properly. Focal speakers have a known impedance dip to about 3 ohms in the mid bass and when the not -so-powerful amplifier gets cranked as is the case here and sees this impedence dip, it just doesn't have the current to do anything so it shuts down.

Many people make the mistake of using Focals with lower powered amplifiers because they are nominally quite efficient, but they are a b i t c h to drive [ for reasons stated above ] and only high current designs should be used with them.

A sub might help, but a new and better amplifier is the real answer.

Dont disagree L but my RXV1800 is driving a pair of B&W 703 which have simmilar low impedance as the focals. The subs cut in at 80hz and with the mains set to small we have no problem driving the ht system to very high spl's. Just sayin

[rantan]

Hi G.

Seems like the sub does a better job than I thought.

It's great that that works well for you and certainly being in that same situation you would have a far better idea than me.

Cheers

[Tweaky]

As a new owner of a Yamaha surround amp RX-V1071 I'll give you my 2c worth of what I think the problem might be based on my use.

It basically all boils down to HDMI sync [well if what I'm experiencing with my components are typical].

HDMI sync allows ONE remote, be it which ever you happen to pick up at the time, to ajust the volume.

The problem with this is that various gain stages of the different components can [when using different remotes to adjust volume [gain stages]] will often only adjust one component, depending if it sees it as the "Master",

For example

Say you pick up your TV's/CD/DVD player etc [insert component that has a gain stage adjustable via remote], that will adjust overall volume via HDMI sync , but it will also adjust your TV's volume to some extent.
Same thing if you pick up your surround amp's remote.

Every time you use a component individually [say TV/CD by itself without surround amp], and you are adjusting the volume/gain, and leave it at the last used level, well you have just adjsuted the parameters that will start up, volume wise, for that component, the next time you use HDMI sync.

The result is that you have two different gain stages [volume controls] working out of sync/ or compeating against each other, depends how you look at it.
Result can cause distortion if not amp clipping.

It's an idiosycrasy of HDMI sync, not much you can do about it unless you have a sound level meter and calibrate your TV's volume via it's remote with your amps volume control with it's remote...basically what you want is "Unitiy gain", wher using either remote adjusts only one gain stage via HDMI sync.

Once you attain this, only use the one [same each time ] remote to adjust overall system volume.

Edited by Tweaky, 11 August 2012 - 12:34 AM.