62 replies to this topic

[JohnA]

I had the honor of been invited to a fellow audiophiles home to listen to a speaker that i had lusted after since its introduction.

I was not prepared for what i saw and heard.

The room and system were simply amazing with attention to detail at every stage.

Here was a room that was just so inviting, a place you could sit for hours on end and listen to his entire music collection.

Now this for me, or as i thought, was simply a chance to listen to a pair of speakers, but its the system and room as whole that makes it what it is.

The system begins with a full quad stack of DSC scarlatti:
Transport, dac, clock and upsampler

the pre, from what i am told is a mohan built unit.

Amps are a pair of 4 channel jeff rowland 4 channel mosnsters

an earthing unit where all equipment is earthed to

and the speakers...............

B&W nautilus snails


From the first note you knew this was something special, the more you listened the more you discovered and the more in awe you were.
the 3d presentation, width and height was simply amazing.

I have never experienced a system that could extract so much information out of a cd.

It was very interesting to speak to the owner and hear his thoughts on how he found the differences in trialing different upsampling rates, and multi bit vs single bit when it came to SACD.

This is now the system by which i judge all others, and i DO WANT a pair of snails, so who is willing to sell me a pair for a bargain price

[Arg]

A good setup is always a pleasure. I wouldn't underestimate the importance of his room to his result.

[JohnA]

the room definately played a huge roll
from design to the incorporated panels, nothing was left to chance.

I still want those speakers....seeing them in the flesh...........
pictures just do nothing for them

[datafone]

I never liked the look of those speaker, but they might be better looking in the flesh...

Defiantly sounds like they deliver the goods though

[Drizt]

You have always wanted a set mate, time to make it happen

[wolster]

Considering what you are used to, John, it must have been a very special system indeed.

[JohnA]

You have always wanted a set mate, time to make it happen

want to loan me the $100+ k to purchase then the money for the 8 channels of amps

never going to happen mate

[JohnA]

Considering what you are used to, John, it must have been a very special system indeed.

it was special indeed, but its not like i got home and no longer wanted to listen to mine

[Drizt]

want to loan me the $100+ k to purchase then the money for the 8 channels of amps

never going to happen mate

pffft, a few extra shifts mate and you'll be right.

[CP_]

I love the snail's looks, and would love to hear them one day as well. Nice story.

[:) al]

well there you go. you finally seeked out the snails

only heard them once myself and know some trash them online and ridicule the, but yeah them special things. glad you have had the chance to hear them in what sounds like a lovely system and surroundings

oh john....you know this is not good....hehe

[Telecine]

It sounds very special indeed. Superb speakers.

I don't suppose that you have any photos you could share?

[Young Skywalker]

This is now the system by which i judge all others, and i DO WANT a pair of snails, so who is willing to sell me a pair for a bargain price

I too have listened to that system, John, and it certainly is an experience. The Bowers and Wilkins Nautilus speakers are certainly lust inducing in their form follows function design and execution but I could understand someone else hating the aesthetics. I do wonder how your own speakers (or mine) would sound in that same room. I have a hunch that you may be shocked to the core but I guess we will never know.

[JohnA]

It sounds very special indeed. Superb speakers.

I don't suppose that you have any photos you could share?

no photos mate, and definately not something i would post without his consent.

Been the first time ever in his home, not something i even thought about doing, even for my own viewing....its like audio porn

[Tax]

Hi John,

I have heard that the Snails driven by the Jeff Rowland's has great synergy.

The countdown has now began in your quest for escargot :-)

Hope it becomes a reality for you. All the best!

[Telecine]

no photos mate, and definately not something i would post without his consent.

Been the first time ever in his home, not something i even thought about doing, even for my own viewing....its like audio porn

I understand. Can't blame a bloke for asking though. I am sure that it was magnificent.

[JohnA]

I too have listened to that system, John, and it certainly is an experience. The Bowers and Wilkins Nautilus speakers are certainly lust inducing in their form follows function design and execution but I could understand someone else hating the aesthetics. I do wonder how your own speakers (or mine) would sound in that same room. I have a hunch that you may be shocked to the core but I guess we will never know.

you could well be right mate, but all i can go on is what i heard on the night compared to the times i heard our speaker systems.
I still think the 2 speaker systems would sound different though.

Hi John,

I have heard that the Snails driven by the Jeff Rowland's has great synergy.

The countdown has now began in your quest for escargot :-)

Hope it becomes a reality for you. All the best!

A great synergy indeed mate. As for it becoming a reality for me, i have never gone past the point of just wanting to listen to them.
There are just some things one knows one could never own.

Edited by JohnA, 13 April 2012 - 04:47 PM.

[cableconnoisseur]

I was fortunate enough to experience a pair of these snails @ Myer when they were being sold there.

I don't know who'd shop for serious hifi at Myers, but they were there for months on end and ended up on sale @ $25K !

They were a static display which means they were never connected to any amplification too!

Of course, I had nowhere near such disposable income at the time (many years ago now) and they were snapped up pretty quickly by some savvy-well-heeled individual, because I never saw them again !!

[JohnA]

I was fortunate enough to experience a pair of these snails @ Myer when they were being sold there.

I don't know who'd shop for serious hifi at Myers, but they were there for months on end and ended up on sale @ $25K !

They were a static display which means they were never connected to any amplification too!

Of course, I had nowhere near such disposable income at the time (many years ago now) and they were snapped up pretty quickly by some savvy-well-heeled individual, because I never saw them again !!

yes, i recall them here in Myer Melbourne when the new electrical section opened up many years ago.
They were behind a glass cabinet, never connected.

Mate i think you would have been impressed with all the various cables in use

[:) al]

can only ever recall one solitary snail in a glass box when they opened the lonsdale street electronics section. but yeah cant remember being much more than matrix series or cdm standmout there to actually listen to. yes was first encounter with a snail and even though not something could listen to. given how many years ago it was just looked at them in awe like they were something from out of this world !

[JohnA]

can only ever recall one solitary snail in a glass box when they opened the lonsdale street electronics section.

thats the one Al
use to go up there everytime was in the city, just for a perve

[wolster]

Certainly a unique design.

[cableconnoisseur]

Y'never know John.

B & W may re-relese them when this GFC thingo goes away sometime in the future.

They could now have them built in China for a lot less $$$ and have a 'best-seller' on their hands?

Everybody's re-releasing stuff these days (not necessarily Chinese built).

Quad did it with their Quad II's.

MacIntosh with their MC275.

BMW with their Mini Cooper.

etc etc.

[JohnA]

Y'never know John.

B & W may re-relese them when this GFC thingo goes away sometime in the future.

They could now have them built in China for a lot less $$$ and have a 'best-seller' on their hands?

Everybody's re-releasing stuff these days (not necessarily Chinese built).

Quad did it with their Quad II's.

MacIntosh with their MC275.

BMW with their Mini Cooper.

etc etc.

they are still in production

HERE YOU GO

Edited by JohnA, 13 April 2012 - 07:14 PM.

[perthpete]

yeah .... living art .. :-)

Nice experience sure!! (Not sure if I would like to listen to them at all .. could probbaly never be content with my own B&Ws .. :-P)

[Phill451]

You are lucky indeed. I doubt I will ever experience such a thing. Like most of the comments it sounds to me like it was not just the speakers but the room and the system that created a unique experience.

[darthlaker]

The Nautilus drivers have pure pistonic motion (unlike all other B&W speakers but that's another story) and were designed by Laurence Dickie.

He is now with Vivid so perhaps they will tickle your fancy.......(BTW, Vandersteen Sevens are also purely pistonic).....

[Young Skywalker]

Mate i think you would have been impressed with all the various cables in use

I seem to recall Audioquest WEL Signature interconnects, Tara Labs The Zero interconnects, NBS power cables, and lots of Shunyata power cables.

He is now with Vivid so perhaps they will tickle your fancy.......(BTW, Vandersteen Sevens are also purely pistonic).....

..... and all drivers in SGR speakers are also purely pistonic in their respective passbands.

Edited by Young Skywalker, 13 April 2012 - 10:10 PM.

[darthlaker]

Yes, YS, the SGR's have excellent drivers....

The "further trick" with pistonic drivers is to get the out of band breakup so far out of band that it's contribution is inaudible which requires both advanced materials and careful design.

At the moment this is not a cheap thing to do but hopefully will be more so in the future....

[Zardoz]

Please don't say the Nautilis. Please don't say the Nau.. Oh bother!

How I have lusted after even a chance to hear these let alone see one in the flesh! I think I'd be quite happy to "settle" for the 800 Diamonds some day. Can't believe they had 'em at Myer and I didn't even get to see them.

That said, I'm very happy with the 805S's ;-)

What on earth does an owner of a pair of Nautilus speakers do for a living?!?

[GFuNK]

The Nautilus drivers have pure pistonic motion (unlike all other B&W speakers but that's another story) and were designed by Laurence Dickie.

He is now with Vivid so perhaps they will tickle your fancy.......(BTW, Vandersteen Sevens are also purely pistonic).....

What do mean by pistonic motion??? Do you mean it responds like a rigid piston? Do you believe B&W solved the problem of cone breakup? .

[hired goon]

G'day,

The room and system were simply amazing with attention to detail at every stage.

Here was a room that was just so inviting, a place you could sit for hours on end and listen to his entire music collection.

And here I was thinking that you were talking about your own room, with the SGRs and TTs and the chair and the posters.

I recall going to a B&W dealership in SLC a few years ago and having a listen to the snails ... v. nice, and v. expensive.

--Geoff

Edited by hired goon, 13 April 2012 - 11:56 PM.

[darthlaker]

The drivers work in a pure pistonic manner which eliminates cone breakup distortion for octaves above the intended upper passband.

The Nautilus was the first B&W speaker to solve cone breakup but for some unknown reason their later models went in a different direction.....

[nevillekapadia]

there is a 20th Anniversary edition due of the snails..........expected to be x2 the cost.

Edited by nevillekapadia, 14 April 2012 - 01:29 AM.

[darthlaker]

You can bid on a pair now!

http://app.audiogon....orsche-midnight

[GFuNK]

The drivers work in a pure pistonic manner which eliminates cone breakup distortion for octaves above the intended upper passband.

The Nautilus was the first B&W speaker to solve cone breakup but for some unknown reason their later models went in a different direction.....

Can you explain that first bit?

These drivers still exhibit structural resonances, they're just outside the frequency range they are driven at.

My guess is that these drivers have some nasty resonances outside their frequency range of intended use and require very steep filters to remove their influence. Also, the usable frequency range in this case is below the first flexural mode of the driver, so balancing this with radiation efficiency means you need more drivers. 4 in the case of the nautilus.

It's always a balancing act.

[darthlaker]

For more info easier to have a read of page 4 here:

http://www.vanderste...7review2010.pdf

Yes, EVERYTHING is a balancing act! Where would the fun be without that!

[GFuNK]

I seem to recall Audioquest WEL Signature interconnects, Tara Labs The Zero interconnects, NBS power cables, and lots of Shunyata power cables.



..... and all drivers in SGR speakers are also purely pistonic in their respective passbands.

You sure about that last claim there?

You guys quote frequency ranges out to 40k, the scan-speak revelator tweeters you use have a particularly nasty breakup approaching 20k. They also have very poor dispersion characteristics above 10k.

Scan-speak's soft dome illuminator tweeter has a flatter response and better dispersion characteristics. The soft dome tweeter is designed for controlled break-up and works quite well.

I'm sure you had your reasons though...

[JohnA]

hey guys, can we try not turn this into a debate on whos is better and bigger

[GFuNK]

hey guys, can we try not turn this into a debate on whos is better and bigger

?

We were talking about the merit of using drivers which respond like an ideal piston in their driven frequency band.

This is a principle B&W adhered to when designing the nautilus.

YS made a claim which I believed to be misleading.

I was also using this opportunity to mention that cone break-up doesn't necessarily equate to a non flat response (relatively speaking of course) by way of an example.

By the way, my favourite speakers are the 802D, and of course the nautilus. I admire B&W for their R&D.

Edited by GFuNK, 14 April 2012 - 09:12 AM.

[JohnA]

yea, but best take it to the great debate section.
I just wanted to tell people about my experience and not get caught up in technical mumbo jumbo or who is right or wrong.

I just dont want to see this thread turned to crap because of people getting caught up in technical discussions, as we all know, they dont turn out well

Not pointing any fingers, or care who is wrong or right, but if people want to discuss it, then i think a new thread in the great debate section would be better place for it

[alistairm]

Sounds like a great experience John. Had to google the speakers to see what you meant and, by thunder, they're gorgeous.

Al

[Mika75]

The room and system were simply amazing with attention to detail at every stage.

John, can you explain further regarding the room size / design / treatment ?

[JohnA]

room size i would be telling fibs, but very large

designed like a cathedral, very high ceilings with lots of different angles.

bass traps, absorption panels and diffusers, all incorporated into the walls, as well as cd racks

Use of diffusion panels was quite extensive indeed, in fact most of the rear of the room was covered in it.

Floor, 3/4 of the room covered in carpet and the rear 1/4 timber.

Speakers were really brought right into the room, i would say a minimum of around 3 mtrs in, maybe even a little more, and listening seat is nearfield

[Young Skywalker]

room size i would be telling fibs, but very large

designed like a cathedral, very high ceilings with lots of different angles.

bass traps, absorption panels and diffusers, all incorporated into the walls, as well as cd racks

Use of diffusion panels was quite extensive indeed, in fact most of the rear of the room was covered in it.

Floor, 3/4 of the room covered in carpet and the rear 1/4 timber.


Speakers were really brought right into the room, i would say a minimum of around 3 mtrs in, maybe even a little more, and listening seat is nearfield

Very good description, John. That is how I remember it also. I have photos but I would not post them without the owner's permission.