TP1 Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Those who have a reasonable vinyl setup can attest to it having "more" to offer than digital. This clip addresses frequency response which is part of the explanation. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metal beat Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Nice visuals that even digital fanbois will find hard to dispute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volunteer sir sanders zingmore Posted October 3, 2014 Volunteer Share Posted October 3, 2014 "Hooked on Classics" goes to 60kHz? You are welcome to it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Nice visuals that even digital fanbois will find hard to dispute. Where there's a will, there's a way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masliko Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Ah,dont be sold just yet,ill post another test,when i find it.....WTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
metal beat Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Where there's a will, there's a way. They will search high and low Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davewantsmoore Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Those who have a reasonable vinyl setup can attest to it having "more" to offer than digital. This clip addresses frequency response which is part of the explanation. Are you saying that reproducing frequencies above 20khz is part of the reason vinyl sounds good? Nice visuals that even digital fanbois will find hard to dispute. There no dispute that vinyl can make sound above 20khz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AccuMagi Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Don't shoot the Messenger, but this is also interesting? Can someone tells me fact vs friction? Few questions: http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=3586 Answers: http://www.realhd-audio.com/?p=3589 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TP1 Posted October 3, 2014 Author Share Posted October 3, 2014 Don't shoot the Messenger, but this is also interesting? Can someone tells me fact vs friction? I'd love to show the fiction 24 Bits but since its not about Vinyl frequency response perhaps it should be discussed in the digital forums Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zog Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 I'm a bit bemused, the 22050Hz max for CDs has been made pretty clear from the very start, I remember reading about it when they first came out. I do remember Daryl Somers grinding a CD into the ground with his foot, and telling everyone it would play just fine as well though, on Hey Hey its Saturday :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addicted to music Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 (edited) I'm a bit bemused, the 22050Hz max for CDs has been made pretty clear from the very start, I remember reading about it when they first came out. I do remember Daryl Somers grinding a CD into the ground with his foot, and telling everyone it would play just fine as well though, on Hey Hey its Saturday :-) Nice visuals that even digital fanbois will find hard to dispute.Sony/Philips made it absolute clear that CD was limited to 22050hz and that it is 16/44 make no mistake. Suits me fine because I don't think I can hear above 20khz. Then there's the battle to fit that on a silver disc and call it a "compact disc" that was only capable of holding 650MB, so for that development in the 80s it was a technological advancement on its own considering HDD was limited to 100-300MB and Win 3.0 was getting released on 1.4MB floppy disc. Advantage selling points are: higher S/N ratio up to 90db, lower distortion and perfect Wow and flutter measurements something a vinyl rig can never achieve.However, I don't think that Daryl Summer grinding a CD with his shoe will play very well as we all know due to the fragility of plastic of the CD! Edited October 3, 2014 by pchan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
astr0b0y Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 I doubt most of you (us) can hear above 12kHz. Since most microphones don't record frequencies that high what the response is showing is introduced distortion. Sounds good sometimes. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leewood Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Nice graph, but what are "YOUR EARS" response to it all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheekyboy Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 I doubt most of you (us) can hear above 12kHz. Since most microphones don't record frequencies that high what the response is showing is introduced distortion. Sounds good sometimes. Agreed, and most musical content is between 50Hz and 6KHz - 8KHz and up above that is mostly hiss and sibilance anyway. Oh, and of course vinyl is far superior to digital!! Cheers, Keith 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vwo60 Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 interesting, all I know is that in my system the vinyl has a more realistic sound than the CD particularly on vocals making it the listening medium of choice, but when you look at vinyl it is not cost effective as my turntable/arm/cartridge would cost eight time more than my CD player to replace. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheekyboy Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 interesting, all I know is that in my system the vinyl has a more realistic sound than the CD particularly on vocals making it the listening medium of choice, but when you look at vinyl it is not cost effective as my turntable/arm/cartridge would cost eight time more than my CD player to replace. You could always spend 8 times more on your CDP, but it isn't going to make any difference! Cheers, Keith 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry218 Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Has anyone realised that Vinyl needs LF EQ ? [emoji4] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheekyboy Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Has anyone realised that Vinyl needs LF EQ ? [emoji4] Do you mean as part of the RIAA EQ? If so, I think most would be aware. Cheers, Keith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry218 Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Do you mean as part of the RIAA EQ? If so, I think most would be aware. Cheers, Keith Yes, its a new concept for me, as im a newbie for vinyl [emoji4] So this is my understanding, pls correct me if im wrong Source recorded and pressed without complete freq response because physically impossible, then the electronics need to compensate it for the playback. Further the mastering engineers need to roll of the LF (assuming modern recordings) before it can be pressed. Is that what happens? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emesbee Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 You could always spend 8 times more on your CDP, but it isn't going to make any difference! Cheers, Keith yes it is (no it isn't, yes it is, no it isn't,......) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve M Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Funny enough in my system the treble response of the vinyl rig is off the planet and the most attractive thing about it! It shimmers and decays much better than digital and is more energetic and vibrant. That could be because of the lively MC cartridges I tend to favour being a Transfiguration Temper, Zyx Airy 3 cryo nude and a Lyra Argo-i. I don't think these cartridges necessarily measure flat, but boy they sound more exciting and real to me. The thing I have noticed is that DSD recordings through CA or an SACD player, which theoretically should have the highest frequency response doesn't quite shimmer and carry on - the DSD sounds a bit too smooth and controlled to me. The spacial aspects and sense of dimensionality of DSD is intact and sounds very good, but the lack of treble energy bothers me somewhat and makes me think it is contrived. The turntable less so in this respect. Steve. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheekyboy Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 yes it is (no it isn't, yes it is, no it isn't,......) Make up your mind, MSB! I do listen to a lot of digital music with three systems here and all capable of digital playback. I agreed with vwo60 and find exactly what he finds and my vinyl front end costs many times the cost of any digital system I have here and probably many times the lot put together for that matter. But, I did at one point have a stock Rega Planar 3 [the same one I had in Adelaide in 2009, but I don't think you ever heard it]. In my front room system when I returned to Melbourne, the Rega was absolutely all over my Consanance Droplet at less than half the cost. That is why I listen to CD/SACD in that system via an Oppo 105 now, which does everything I expect from a digital front end, especially with SACD, but it will never come anywhere near the vinyl playback. Cheers, Keith 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Good Vibe Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 Very true Keith, the next step are the master tape's but not every ones cupa. And the well produced record cleaned on well set up table can be 4 5ths of a tape Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheekyboy Posted October 3, 2014 Share Posted October 3, 2014 (edited) Very true Keith, the next step are the master tape's but not every ones cupa. And the well produced record cleaned on well set up table can be 4 5ths of a tape Yeah, Doc, I had RTR decks back in the '70s and '80s and some particular tape at that time was the best thing I'd heard in a sound system, but I really couldn't be bothered with tape now. The point I was trying to make above is that you don't need to spend an awful lot on a vinyl rig for it to better than even good digital playback. Cheers, Keith Edited October 3, 2014 by cheekyboy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emesbee Posted October 4, 2014 Share Posted October 4, 2014 Make up your mind, MSB! I do listen to a lot of digital music with three systems here and all capable of digital playback. I agreed with vwo60 and find exactly what he finds and my vinyl front end costs many times the cost of any digital system I have here and probably many times the lot put together for that matter. But, I did at one point have a stock Rega Planar 3 [the same one I had in Adelaide in 2009, but I don't think you ever heard it]. In my front room system when I returned to Melbourne, the Rega was absolutely all over my Consanance Droplet at less than half the cost. That is why I listen to CD/SACD in that system via an Oppo 105 now, which does everything I expect from a digital front end, especially with SACD, but it will never come anywhere near the vinyl playback. Cheers, Keith Fair enough Keith. My system is probably a bit more modest than yours. I have a Rega Planar 3 that I bought 2nd hand some years ago (bought it from a pawn shop!). Its not quite standard, the previous owner has fitted a Glanz tonearm and cartridge. On the digital side, I have an Oppo 103 going into a CA DacMagic. Both are connected to a Musical Fidelity E100 amp driving a pair of VAF i91s for music listening. (The 5.1 analog outs from the Oppo 103 also go to a Marantz AVR driving 4 x VAF DC-Xs and a DC-6 for surround sound when playing DVD and blu-ray discs. I did have a Musical Fidelity E11 connected in as well, but took it out last week as the left channel appears to be developing a problem.) I daresay I could choose to spend a lot more on both my vinyl and digital setups, but I am reasonably happy with both at the moment. The vinyl is not a clear winner in my setup though. It really depends on the particular recording. Yes, I do have some recordings on both vinyl and CD where I think the vinyl sounds better, but that is not universally the case. In the end, though, I still think a lot of it comes down to personal preference. If one's preference is for vinyl, then one is obviously more inclined to spend more on a turntable rig. Cheers, Mike 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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