A nice amp?

[crimson_stallion]

Hi,

I know not too much about home audio, and all the audio knowledge I do have is in the car audio scene. So firstly, are there any major issues I should know about home audio that your typical car audio dude wouldn't know?

Next question, what are the main components neccessary in a hi-fi system?

I'm looking at spending around:

CD player: Up to $1000
Preamp: unsure $$
Amplifier; Up to $1500
Tuner: Up to maybe $500
Speakers: Up to $1800

What are some options that you think may be worth considering in these ranges?

Next question is regarding amplifiers. For now, I just want a simple two speaker hi fi setup (no sub / surround) but at a later stange I may introduce a sub and surrounds. As such im considering going for a surround amp over a stereo amp. Is there any advantage of a stereo amp over a equivalent surround amp?

Secondly i've read some good thigns about Rotels RMB1075. Anyone here had experience, if have any comments / recommendations for or against this amp? Also any suggestions at what may be a better bet?

To help with recommendations, i'll give you abit of info about what I like and the type of setup im looking at.


-------


From car audio experience, ive generally liked soft, smooth (yet thick) sounding speakers (Dynaudio, Morel, etc).

I like bass, to complement music, rather then overtake it. i.e. I like quite a neutral ballance between bass/treble/midrange.

I listen to alot of RnB (some slow, some more upbeat), some dance, and occasionally some rock/alternative.

As far as speakers go, what do you gusy think of DynAudio's Audience bookshelfs?

Sorry for the long post, but im quite a newbie so im trying to give as much info as i can to help someone hopefully help me :)

Any help is appreciated
Pete.

[56oval]

in Sydney you have a good selection of outlets look at some of there higher end exdemo or second hand equipment you can get some great buys.I bought AudioNote pre & power at good prices and still had good resale prices when I upgraded them.There is also great locally made equipment,my dac is locally made ,transformer couple pre and next power amps and cd transport so have a look.all the best Malcolm. :p :p

[crimson_stallion]

Thanks :)

Some speaker brands im considering at the moment are:
*Quad
*Equinox
*Dynaudio
*Focal

As for the amps, i dont really know many brands :( so I guess maybe:
*Rotel
*NAD
*Cambridge
*Harmon Kardon
*Denon

Because these are about the only brands i've heard anything about :)

Actually im not even sure if all of the above make amps or not.. i'm really lost :( lol

[dazd]

the guy on ebay has relisted teh audience 42s for $850!!!!

[shiny_car]

Originally posted by crimson_stallion
I'm looking at spending around:

CD player: Up to $1000
Preamp: unsure $$
Amplifier; Up to $1500
Tuner: Up to maybe $500
Speakers: Up to $1800
i'd suggest spending more on the speakers, even if it means dropping the budget elsewhere, because the speakers are arguably the most important component of them all.

so, for example, you should be able to attain 'better' sound with $3000 speakers and a $1000 integrated amp than $1800 speakers and a $2200 pre-power combo.

$1000 will buy a nice CD player and $500 will buy a decent tuner (although if you want a matching tuner (cosmetcially/series) for the CD player you'd probably need to spend more...but if you can go without that, you probably won't need to, subject to your priorities of how important listening to radio is).

:)

[crimson_stallion]

Originally posted by shiny_car
i'd suggest spending more on the speakers, even if it means dropping the budget elsewhere, because the speakers are arguably the most important component of them all.

so, for example, you should be able to attain 'better' sound with $3000 speakers and a $1000 integrated amp than $1800 speakers and a $2200 pre-power combo.

$1000 will buy a nice CD player and $500 will buy a decent tuner (although if you want a matching tuner (cosmetcially/series) for the CD player you'd probably need to spend more...but if you can go without that, you probably won't need to, subject to your priorities of how important listening to radio is).

:)
Cool thanks for the tips :)

$500 for a tuner sounds good, and $1000 for a CD player should be fine. Just a matter of whether I'll be able to stretch 3g's for speakers. What do you think of the idea of gong with something around say the $1000-$1500 mark temporarilly and then moving them at the back later as surrounds?

My brother has an NAD amp and preamp that he said he might give/sell to me because he needs a surround amp.

Maybe for now thatll do?

No sure about model numbers but I can check and then repost those.

[crimson_stallion]

The following are the models of my brothers gear that he may give/sell to me.

NAD C541 CD Player
NAD Preamplifier 114
NAD Power Amplifier 214

Is this stuff decent?

[dazd]

yes thats decent stuff
entry level in terms of real hi-fi but good stuff.
entry level electronics from NAD or rotel or cambridge u cant realli go wrong. I know every1 on here says it but its because its tru.

id also suggest spending more on speakers as shiny said, the idea of gettin cheaper ones now and then movin them to surrounds later sounds good in theory but in reality you may never end up completing the system. Personally i think you should spend less on ur electronics and more on ur speakers OR save up, spend the same on electronics as proposed but with the extra money get better speakers.
Another possibility is DIY speakers.

[Greg Erskine]

Hi Pete,

Don't forget to have a look at Australian made speakers. Have a look in the Audio Directory. For $2K you should be able to get some very good speakers IMHO. I'm very happy with my VAFs.

Once you get speakers of the quality you are looking at, your choice of amps will make difference. You need to get an amp that matches your speakers and your personal tastes.

[crimson_stallion]

I'll take a look at some aussie speakers. Which brands do you recommend?

My brother has an accusound set, how do they rate? I dont think they were very expensive...

[xlarge-nz]

Originally posted by shiny_car
i'd suggest spending more on the speakers, even if it means dropping the budget elsewhere, because the speakers are arguably the most important component of them all.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with this comment. Speakers can only ever sound as good as the electronics driving them. Quality power delivery is paramount in getting a good sound from speakers. This requires firstly good current drive and secondly enough voltage to output to the required listening level without clipping and provide adequate dynamic headroom.

Of course the power requirement is all relative to preferred listening level and the size of the room you are trying to fill.

Keep in mind that speakers are dynamic loads and although can be nominally 8 ohms will, 9 times out of 10, vary widely from this due to the capacitive and inductive properties of both the drivers and crossover network. This is where the current requirements can go through the roof, sometimes in excess of 20A momentarily. This is the downfall of cheaper amplifiers, they just don't supply good, solid current. And this will effect any speaker at all, cheap or expensive.

crimson_stallion> I'd tend to pick the electronics first then find a speaker that is well suited to the amplifier and also provides a sound that you enjoy. Stick to your original budget initially and see what you come up with. Buying more expensive speakers from the outset won't necessarily yield better results, and in the end could just be wasted money because you'll be limited by your amplifier.

Your brothers NAD gear is good and if he'll GIVE it to you, even better, LOL :)

A couple of things to keep in mind when selecting speakers - try and get as sensitive as possible (lets face it the NAD isn't a powerhouse), audition the speakers in your own environment (this is probably THE biggest factor in how the system will ultimately sound) and enjoy the process :)

Good luck...

[crimson_stallion]

Originally posted by xlarge-nz
I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with this comment. Speakers can only ever sound as good as the electronics driving them. Quality power delivery is paramount in getting a good sound from speakers. This requires firstly good current drive and secondly enough voltage to output to the required listening level without clipping and provide adequate dynamic headroom.

Of course the power requirement is all relative to preferred listening level and the size of the room you are trying to fill.

Keep in mind that speakers are dynamic loads and although can be nominally 8 ohms will, 9 times out of 10, vary widely from this due to the capacitive and inductive properties of both the drivers and crossover network. This is where the current requirements can go through the roof, sometimes in excess of 20A momentarily. This is the downfall of cheaper amplifiers, they just don't supply good, solid current. And this will effect any speaker at all, cheap or expensive.

crimson_stallion> I'd tend to pick the electronics first then find a speaker that is well suited to the amplifier and also provides a sound that you enjoy. Stick to your original budget initially and see what you come up with. Buying more expensive speakers from the outset won't necessarily yield better results, and in the end could just be wasted money because you'll be limited by your amplifier.

Your brothers NAD gear is good and if he'll GIVE it to you, even better, LOL :)

A couple of things to keep in mind when selecting speakers - try and get as sensitive as possible (lets face it the NAD isn't a powerhouse), audition the speakers in your own environment (this is probably THE biggest factor in how the system will ultimately sound) and enjoy the process :)

Good luck...
I just checked out the link to those Image speakers you listed in your sig, and couldnt help but notice that they use morel drivers. Being somewhat of a fan of Morel car speakers, I noticed the mid/tweets look a hell of alot like the Elate/Supremo Car audio speakers. Any idea if there is any relation, as I love the sound of those speakers!

Also any idea how much they go for? I'm particuarly interested in the 'studio reference' ones listed here.
http://www.imageloudspeakers.com/products/...s/refstudio.htm (http://www.imageloudspeakers.com/products/refstudio.htm)

Cheers! :)

[xlarge-nz]

I had no idea that Morel did a line of car speakers also. It's quite possible that they could sound similar, as designers/manufacturers typically tend to have a 'house sound'. In that they have a design philosophy and usually stick to it across the board. Even though cheaper components use cheaper parts they will still try to get across their 'signature' sound.

As for the Image 'Studio Reference' speakers, they are a great sounding speaker and fairly cheap. From memory they are NZ$999 inc. GST. They are an easy speaker to drive and I think they would go well with your brothers NAD electronics. The difficulty would be you auditioning them, because as far as I know Image don't have a distributor over there. And I wouldn't suggest you buy them solely on my word, you need to listen to them for yourself.

The best thing would be to get in touch with Image and see what they can do.

[Marc]

Morel Domestic Audio Australian Information:
http://www.rmaudio.com.au/morel_home/Home_...io_Entrance.htm (http://www.rmaudio.com.au/morel_home/Home_Audio_Entrance.htm)

[shiny_car]

Originally posted by xlarge-nz
I'm sorry, but I have to disagree with this comment. Speakers can only ever sound as good as the electronics driving them. Quality power delivery is paramount in getting a good sound from speakers.
yup, that's a totally fair opinion. 'crap in = crap out' (sic).

as with many things, the law of diminishing returns comes into play. plus you must consider 'where' along the spectrum you place your own limitations. so whilst i don't believe there's a definite right or wrong, i personally bias my budget more towards the speakers.

:)

[Greg Erskine]

Look here:

http://www.planetaudio.com.au/forums/local...n=links&catid=2 (http://www.planetaudio.com.au/forums/local_links.php?action=links&catid=2)

[crimson_stallion]

I know about the list, I just don't know which of those are good/great/not so great etc.

Thanks anyway though :)


Originally posted by xlarge-nz
I had no idea that Morel did a line of car speakers also. It's quite possible that they could sound similar, as designers/manufacturers typically tend to have a 'house sound'. In that they have a design philosophy and usually stick to it across the board. Even though cheaper components use cheaper parts they will still try to get across their 'signature' sound.

http://www.morel.co.il/car.htm

They have some really excellent car audio gear. Got a set of the base model Pulse splits in my car system at the moment :)

[Greg Erskine]

hi crimson_stallion,

From what I read it seems the Australian speaker manufactures are as good as the imports but because there are built locally represent better value, but YMMV. I have recently bought VAF DC-X speakers so obviously they appealed to me and I am very happy with them. I wanted a Australian semi-built kit and the VAFs were really my only option. I sure others on the list are also well thought of.

Teamed with my AKSA, the VAFs provide crystal clear mids and high with a good soundstage. The bass is very well controlled without any boominess I was used to with my previous speakers. Initially I thought some bass was missing but soon I realised that I was actually hearing lower notes than I had ever heard before but the boominess (the distorted bass noise?) was gone.

I'm finding speakers of this quality (and I guess it would be the same for other brands) really highlight the difference in amps and the quality of CD recordings.

This hifi stuff is very personal and you'll find a lot of conflicting views and in the end you must decide what pleases you. :mrgreen:

Hope this helps a little.
Greg

[crimson_stallion]

Thanks, every little bit of advice helps :)

[crimson_stallion]

Originally posted by xlarge-nz
I had no idea that Morel did a line of car speakers also. It's quite possible that they could sound similar, as designers/manufacturers typically tend to have a 'house sound'. In that they have a design philosophy and usually stick to it across the board. Even though cheaper components use cheaper parts they will still try to get across their 'signature' sound.

As for the Image 'Studio Reference' speakers, they are a great sounding speaker and fairly cheap. From memory they are NZ$999 inc. GST. They are an easy speaker to drive and I think they would go well with your brothers NAD electronics. The difficulty would be you auditioning them, because as far as I know Image don't have a distributor over there. And I wouldn't suggest you buy them solely on my word, you need to listen to them for yourself.

The best thing would be to get in touch with Image and see what they can do.I've heard and loved Morels flagship Elate car speakers and flagship Supremo car tweeter, so i'm sure these would have a very very similar sound (they are around $900 and $700 respectively).

Just contacted Image. I was given a retail price and an 'ex-works' price. Any idea what this 'ex-works' means?

Also, the RRP is for $999 NZ. Any idea of roughly much much that would be in AUS$$ ?</span>


<span style=\'font-family:Arial\'>Thanks:)

[xlarge-nz]

Hmmmm, unsure what the 'ex-works' price means. Maybe you will be able to buy direct from the factory, due to the lack of disitrbution in Australia.

NZ$999 is approximately AU$918...

[crimson_stallion]

Seems like you are correct, looks like ex works means ex factory basically. Basically I buy straight from the factory, but pay postage myself.

[56oval]

the front end is important because you can,t correct a bad signal with other equipment down the line . when it comes to speakers look at sensitivity and load something around 90DB and up and something that doesn,t drop below 6to4 ohms and that will make picking an amp easier .