Valve Buffer?

[hired goon]

G'day,

So if I wanted a valve sound on certain occasions without using a valve preamp, valve power amp, or valve CD player, then I'd probably want to get some type of valve buffer, which sits in between the source and the pre-amp (or perhaps in the tape loop so it can be switched in and out as desired).

What are the options available here? There's the Musical Fidelity X10v3 vacuum tube buffer (or its predecessor). I'm not aware of any other products that perform this function. Are there any alternatives to the X10? Are there kits that can be built for this purpose?

Enquiring minds want to know.

--Geoff

[Rick]

Just get a cheap and nasty EQ for the tape loop, it should have enough THD and you can change the FR to your hearts content.

Rick.

[hired goon]

G'day,



Just get a cheap and nasty EQ for the tape loop, it should have enough THD and you can change the FR to your hearts content.[/b]
:biggrin: I expected that from you, Rick :biggrin:

Seriously, is that *all* a tube does? I mean, can you add EQ to a solid-state pre-amp so that it becomes indistinguishable (in a blind test) from a pre-amp with a particular valve, all other things being equal?

--Geoff

[Rick]

G'day,
:biggrin: I expected that from you, Rick :biggrin:
[/b]
Sorry, couldn't resist :blum:


Seriously, is that *all* a tube does? I mean, can you add EQ to a solid-state pre-amp so that it becomes indistinguishable (in a blind test) from a pre-amp with a particular valve, all other things being equal?
--Geoff
[/b]
Ok, to get serious.

In some cases yes.
Some tube products produce enormous amounts of distortion and roll off the frequency extremes by a large degree, yes, this can almost be simulated with poor EQ.
Some tube products also contaminate the signal in other ways.
Most of the differing qualities of some tube sound can be easily quantified.

It needs to be remembered, that top quality tube products are virtually indistinguishable from top quality SS product. Even in blind tests.

My experience has told me that their is nothing magic about tubes, there are good ones, and there are bad ones, just like SS.

Rick.

[alebonau]

G'day,

So if I wanted a valve sound on certain occasions without using a valve preamp, valve power amp, or valve CD player, then I'd probably want to get some type of valve buffer, which sits in between the source and the pre-amp (or perhaps in the tape loop so it can be switched in and out as desired).

What are the options available here? There's the Musical Fidelity X10v3 vacuum tube buffer (or its predecessor). I'm not aware of any other products that perform this function. Are there any alternatives to the X10? Are there kits that can be built for this purpose?

Enquiring minds want to know.

--Geoff
[/b]

geoff the mf valve output stages are not just for the valve sound but also do impedance matching. People use them on outputs of cd players/sources plus between pre & power amps as well.

MF's original X-10D is still a hugely popular device still selling on the likes of ebay that people use exactly for this purpose. My old mf valve dac basically had the same valve output stage usign the same 6922 e88c valves - the same are used in the likes of the top of the range starship enterprise shanling CD player on its output stage, hugh dean's aksa uses the same valves in the output stage of his hybrid pre - excellent sound, as does mf's headphone current amps, the consonance calliffe integrated uses the same valves as well as does the elektra pre. These 6922 valves add a nice valve warmth/euphonics ? and feel to the sound. And there are various different brands you can experiment with eg the russian ones have a cleaner more neutral sound etc. Quite a few other products usign other valves on the output stage eg the droplet CD player and cary disc players etc.

There is also the current x10v3 usign a milspec valve, more clean and neutral again to the original x10 and mf is using these valves in the output stage of its A5cd player and standalone DAC. Many of MFs top of the range massive kw range of products also use these valves. The best option with these valve output stages is borrow one from your local MF dealer and give it a shot in the fashion you have in mind. you'll soon know if you like its effect or not. The impedance matching benefits is system dependant and ofcourse the sound charecter is a personal preference thing.

[WINEDS]

I tried the X10 V3 with my system a few weeks ago. Although I thought I perceived a slighlty silkier sound, and a slighlty wider sound stage - I couldn't pick it on blind A - B tests.

[ozcal]

I tried the X10 V3 with my system a few weeks ago. Although I thought I perceived a slighlty silkier sound, and a slighlty wider sound stage - I couldn't pick it on blind A - B tests.
[/b]
Valve amps differ in sonic presentation from their SS relatives as do the new generation of 'digital' amps form their more standard ss relatives ,you pays your money........
Adding an additional stage between you and the music will have one major effect and that is to reduce transparency, can't be helped just the nature of adding extra electronics ,cables ,connectors etc ,etc.We all want a warm ,enveloping but at the same time realistic sound however imo adding a valve buffer will only lead to greater colouration and loss of information.
One of the major problems ,classical recordings aside, is the poor sound quality ,'made for radio', of many modern recordings and this becomes all too apparent once you have quality ie transparent equipment.On that basis perhaps a bit of even order harmonic distortion is not such a bad thing :blum:
Gordon